Ground Zero

00:00 Father, we're before you, and Lord, Adam and I are just real guys, and we sometimes come to your throne tired like the warrior's a child sometimes. And so today we come before you, bringing everything we are, what we have, and even what we don't have, to you to lay at your feet. Father, we pray that these conversations will be meaningful, not only for us, but for those who hear, those who listen. And Father, our heart is to help people on this journey of faith navigate the complexities of culture and the world.

00:40 Feels like sometimes things are aligned against us and against our faith in this world. And yet, Jesus, you said it was going to be that way. Even as John Eldridge wrote in one of his books, we were born into a world at war. So, Lord, we thank you that we get to do this. And so, today we commit our hearts, our lives, everything we are for your glory. In Jesus' name, amen. Amen. It's Wednesday, October 29th, 2025. We get to do this. This is number eight. This is the life we've been blessed with.

01:20 This is a gift we get to do this. This is a chance we did not miss. This is the life we get to do this. Yo, brother, how you doing? Sleepy this morning. Really? I woke up at like three o'clock. Oh, no. This is no. I got a God tap. Oh, that is between 3 and 5 a.m. That's his. Well, it came in the form of I need to go to the bathroom. You know, that's typical dude stuff when you're my age. This is God speaking. You need to pee. Your bladder's exploding. So I get up and you don't take it as a god tap. It's like, okay, you got to do what you do.

02:01 And then you come back to bed and then you're like wide awake. Yeah. And that does not happen to me often. So when it happens, I've learned to say, okay, what's up, Lord? And so it just launched me into a probably 45-minute time of prayer and fellowship with him and all over the map, you know. I mean, into, I'm sort of a little in and out, you know, where I'm praying and then it's like, wait, what was I saying? You know, I was running down some track, you know. But the Lord, I mean, even that's very scriptural, by the way. David talks about talking to God in the night watches. And I think one of the reasons why the Lord taps us in the middle of the night sometimes is because it's when we're not fully distracted by what we're doing in the moment.

02:49 When you're just laying here, you're listening to Mr. Chevy, my dog, snore, you know, and that's it. I mean, there's nothing else going on. Got the whir of the sound machine, you know, and that's it. And so I think we're more open to hear his voice and probably our prayers are different at that time. Oh, I totally agree. It's more authentic. You know, again, we're not on the run. There's no distractions. It's dark. It's quiet. Absolutely. Yeah. No rush. You know, you've wrote a daily grind this morning, which was about intentionality. I think you've been on this for a couple of days. And that was my first thing. I'm like, I want to ask Pastor Jimmy about this. I want to ask about this intentionality.

03:32 The way I took it is doing everything intentionally for God and thinking about that continuously, which in today's world is one of the hardest things you can imagine to do because of all the distractions and noise and everything. So I just wanted to open it up to you and just hear what you had to say because I think it's important to share this. I appreciate that. I found this great scripture in Ephesians 5:17 in the New Living Translation, which, you know, that kind of breaks it down to a little more casual conversation. It says, don't act thoughtlessly, but understand what the Lord wants you to do. So I've re-engaged Sabbath on Mondays. Yes. And, you know, it's not just a day to play.

04:16 It's really a day to rest, my soul. And, you know, the word restoration to restore, it's the root of that is rest, right? You restore and you experience restoration through rest. So the Lord commands a Sabbath. And, you know, there are people who interpret that differently. Well, you know, we're in New Testament times. You could do a little here, do a little there. That's what I used to do. And I did that. But, you know, truly, it always got put on the back burner. It always got usurped by something else more important than spending time with God and resting. And I let it go for a season because church is growing, is growing, and kind of all hands on deck.

04:57 So I quite literally, and I'm just going to be very transparent. transparent. I felt guilty for being at home resting in the Lord, reading a book, writing in my journal, playing some music, you know, my worship time while the team was up here working. And I just, I let that get over on me. And truly, I believe it was the enemy, an intrusive thought that began to get in my head that, oh man, you're not pulling your weight. You know, your team's up there working and you're at home. That I think is something very of the modern age and very of the competitive age. And ever since we started working from home, I think, you know, rest has really left us in so many different ways.

05:44 Having started and run companies, small to big, man, I know that feeling. And especially when your employees are working, you feel like, ah, am I being even a good leader and doing not being there every single minute of the day when they're there? We know the enemy is an opportunist. He leverages pain, trauma. He leverages moments. He leverages even the tiniest thing. So if you feel a little bit of that guilt, like, man, here I am enjoying as being with the Lord and being restored, never mind that I did two meetups, two shows, two sermons, to use your terminology,

06:25 two services back to back, got up there, played on the worship team and preached. I mean, it's a lot. It's a full day's work in about, you know, eight and a half, nine hours. So you come home totally toasted. But it's not just physical work, it's emotional and spiritual. There is spiritual warfare. And unless you've really experienced that, it's hard to explain to people the toll that takes on your soul. But any pastor that ever takes a moment to listen to what we're doing would go, totally get you, brother. Totally understand. Yes, I know exactly what that is. So I don't actually try to talk about that a lot because I understand there's not a category for that unless you've walked in the shoes.

07:07 So pastors and podcasters, it's very similar, brothers. It's very similar. We do the same thing. We do meetups, we do shows. Exactly. You know, we cue the mic, you know, we record. A lot of emails, a lot of people talking to you, a lot of people who want information or have advice. Yeah. A lot of advice. A lot of a better way to do it. Build a better mousetrap. So anyway, so I reinstituted, just re-engaged Sabbath. And I actually repented to the Lord. I said, I'm so sorry. I was disobedient. I thought I was doing it for noble reasons. But what I realized is I started getting super tired. I began to just run down. And we were traveling a lot. We had a lot of things going on.

07:49 We dialed all that back. And I just repented. I said, Lord, I'm so sorry. You've given this to me as a gift and I pushed it back. I can't imagine how that feels. I mean, I can't. I can imagine if I was to do something for somebody that was for their good, for the win for them, and they just push it back to me and say, No, I'm too busy. So, how do we even manage that? In, you know, because weekends, we've got activities with the kids. I don't anymore, but we got all kinds of stuff. And should it be like I, from what I understand, how Charlie Kirk literally put his phone away.

08:29 I've not been successful of that. Tina and I haven't even really discussed it. Probably because our wives don't listen to the podcast. Otherwise, it would have come up. There's an Easter egg. We're dropping them all the time, which is not a slight. That's very, that's very normal. Right. You know, how do we do that? And what should it constitute? I mean, should you just be in the word all day? Should you just be thinking, meditating? Can you do things that bring you joy? You know, how do you see that? And again, I think it's very difficult for people to set this time aside. It is. But is it really? Well, is it really that difficult if you look at what we're spending our time on?

09:14 There you go. The truth is, and let's just get to the truth and we can reverse near that back to some compassion. So the truth is, is that we all do what we want to do. We can find time and prioritize time for anything we want to do. Maybe I'm just talking about myself, but anything that's important to me, I'll figure out a way to do it. Priority, it's about prioritization of time. And so if you believe God's word and believe he's called us, called us to this, and believe that it's a gift for us, then you have to say, I'm going to prioritize this.

09:54 And when I I didn't, it didn't go well for me. I found myself fatigued, exhausted, tired, living for a day that didn't come, a day of rest. You know, funerals popped up in the middle on days I thought I had margin, it was gone. Emergencies, crises. I was on the phone last night with a crisis, and I thought I had a nice evening, and it turned into having to deal with some really serious, heavy stuff. And that's just the life that we live. And it's not just a pastor's life, it's everybody's life. We all have very little margin in our lives. So back to my statement about truth. We all do what we really want to do and what we believe is worthwhile.

10:38 We'll push everything away for it. So, really, it comes down to: do we believe God has given this to us as a gift? And if we do, then what are we going to do to prioritize that? And the interesting thing is, he doesn't give it to us for himself, he gives it to us for us. And I think that's hard for us to accept sometimes. We're all about, as leaders, especially, or whether you're a dad or a mom, you're leading your home. You may be a boss, you're leading in a workplace, whatever. We lead at different levels, but all of us feel the weight and responsibility of leadership so much so that we'll prioritize everybody else's well-being over ours.

11:23 So then we do something for us, we feel guilty, or we feel like we've run off into the other bar ditch where it's all about us. And that's the thing: you've got to realize God gave us something, it's a gift from him. The best thing I can do for him is bless him by receiving that gift. You know, when you do something for somebody and they're just like, yeah, whatever, it's just kind of like, whoa, okay. I really did that for you. I did it. You know, it would have been nice to just some acknowledgement there. Yeah. By the way, thanks for the probes, the amazing gift for Pastor Appreciation Month. I got to highlight this for a moment. I knew you would the meter? The meter. The meter is the duo pro, brother.

12:06 And I'll tell you, it's amazing. I was gifted this by a friend. Yeah. And right away, I'm like, oh, man. Oh, man. This is too good. And Tina's like, you got to give that to Pastor Jimmy for his birthday. When's his birthday? January. No, that's not going to work. He's going to see him. This is no good. So I was looking for an excuse. I'm like, I don't need an excuse to give my friend something, but it is Pastor Appreciation Month. So let me say it like this. So you gave that gift to me. I received it and I got excited about it. Oh, my gosh, this is me. Can't wait. This is such a great analogy. I go home, I unpack it. You know, I read the very bad instructions, by the way.

12:44 Not clear. No, it's not. It's not clear. I mean, it took me a great product. It took me a while to figure out you had to have the block of wood next to the thing. You mentioned that to me. I did that. So it fires right up. My trick. Yeah, you got a Bluetooth. You got to get them on Wi-Fi. I mean, there's some little steps. But it was fun because I was excited about it, right? So something you're excited about, you put energy into, right? You prioritize it. Wow, it was a great thing. Hey, you need to get that thing fired up because we're getting ready to cook some steaks at KNC, you know? And so all that to say is that because it meant something to me and it was something that I saw value in,

13:24 man, I tore that box open. I'm getting it all ready. I'm reading the bad instructions, you know, because going, okay, what's going on? So anyway, but it was actually easy to figure out. And man, was able to get it fired up. And then I enjoyed the benefit of the gift. But here's the deal: I didn't want to just enjoy it. I wanted you to enjoy the benefit of you knowing how blessed I was to get it. So what do I do? I screenshot. I screenshot the settings and send them over to you. Then you screenshot yours and send them back. All that to say, there was this cool exchange of blessing. Yes. You were blessed to give it to me. I was blessed to receive it. And then I wanted to bless you back by saying, this is amazing.

14:06 So that's the value of a gift. Hold on right there because I, of course, I got a lot of joy out of that. I'm not sure. I'm trying to feel this now. I'm not sure if I always get that same joyous feeling from my Sabbath and the gift that God has given me and back and forth. It's different. I kind of want it to be like that, though. I get it. You know what I mean? I mean, here's why it's different: because we have a very real enemy, and it's the devil, Satan, Lucifer, whatever. I talked about this on Sunday in the message. But we have a very real enemy who wants to undermine anything that we're doing in terms of our relationship with God.

14:49 with God? So, where we're finding joy in some gift he's giving us, we get email bombs, some stupid email of somebody who's angry or critical or mad. And then all of a sudden, you make the mistake going, oh, I got it. Okay, I got Outlook. I've got several notifications. I'll just check these real quick. And then you go, Why did I look at that? Yeah. Because what does it do? It steals your attention. Wow. So maybe the intentionality has to first come from realizing that the enemy is trying to thwart you continuously throughout your Sabbath time with God.

15:28 Bingo. Oh, that's good. Case in point. So, Sabbath, technically, if you're going to do it in Jewish style, you start it at Friday. Yeah, the evening before. And so I do mine on Monday because I just, for work schedule, that works the best. And I'm the most tired after Sunday. So that works good for me. So, so technically, if I would have been thinking and been more thoughtful and intentional, it would start Sunday night. Sunday evening while we're watching NCIS, you know, episode 20, whatever. Season 21. No, we're in 22 now, so we're about to catch up. So anyway, we're doing our thing, just kind of, you know,

16:09 brain, you know, just resting, resting, enjoying it, and enjoying the evening. I noticed a couple of pop-ups on my phone that's sitting over there. It lights up. Big mistake. Should have had it laying like this, but I didn't add it. And I saw, I said, oh, got a couple. Oh, I got a text from a friend. I look it up and it's, it's not good. It's not a good, it's not good. It's not terrible, but it's just like it's a little bit of drama. And I'm just like, why did I look at that? Yeah. Here I am starting into my, and sure enough, I knew it was the enemy. I knew it in the moment. It's not that friend. It's not that person who needed some attention or needed, you know, some stuff, needed something.

16:54 It's not that. It's the enemy leveraging the timing of that. Because, I mean, we need to deal with stuff. I mean, things happen. You can't just avoid, you know, life drama. It's like I told you this morning, it's job security for me. I mean, come on, this is why I have a job, right? Because of life drama. It was one of the funniest textbooks. Well, it is what it is. You know, you boil some of this stuff down. You go, man, let's just be real. So I can laugh about it. It helps me deal with it too. But I didn't have to look at it on Sunday night when we're just resting. We're tired. We've had a great week. Yeah. This long weekend. This immediacy of life is, you know, of course, when all of this was written and when Jesus walked the earth, guess what they didn't have?

17:39 Internet, cell phones, you know, there was a lot of stuff. There was a very real devil who was doing the same stuff. Of course. Just not with the phone. But it would be so much more obvious. Like you're sitting out there in the middle of the night tending to your sheep and then a lion comes along like, okay, you know, this is obvious. Whereas every notification can be a lion for you that's coming to get you. Or it can be a positive. It could be a very life-giving, wonderful thing. That's the trickery of it. Yes. Yeah. For the one bad thing you get, you get 20 good things. So you just sort of like a fish, you know, with the bait dangling in front of you, you take it.

18:20 And there was a great title to a book called The Bait of Satan. Yes. By John Bevere. And it's that. It's just, you took the bait when nine times out of ten, it's a positive thing. Summarizing right now in the middle of this, the problem is the phone. This is our biggest problem. I mean, seriously. I know. And is it really a phone? No. It's a computer. I mean, this thing is like unbelievable. It's the enemy's portal into your head, is what it is. And of course, the thing that is in our minds all the time is, well, what if it's my kids? What if it's this?

19:01 What if it's that? Which is also the enemy working, of course. Thank you. I'm just repeating what I'm thinking. I just got to trust God that everything's going to be okay, that he's got it and his will is his will. Nothing I can really change anyway. And this kind of goes back. I remember before phones, my mom would always say, no news is good news. Yeah. Yeah. I say, so you don't remember that. You don't care if you don't hear. No, no news is good news. And maybe that's true. There's some truth to that. Yeah, but we just didn't have that. And man, it's just making me, I have not been good at keeping my phone away. Well, here's why I'm glad you brought this up. Yeah. Because I want to always be open and honest. honest when we're doing podcasting.

19:46 I want people to know, man, I'm dealing with stuff too. I mean, sometimes people look at pastors or they'll look at you with your life and your background and think, man, everything's great. This guy's got it all together. They're made. They're podcasting. They're moving and shaking in the world. But at the end of the day, you know, we just got stuff like everybody else. You know, we put our pants on like everybody else, one leg at a time, right? Except then we make hit records, more cowbells. Sorry, couldn't help myself. Exactly. So I like that we talk about things that are hard too and things that are real because those intrusive things, it starts me down a line where I get into a mind war because then I start thinking, man, it's bad.

20:32 And then it just morphs into it's horrible. Yes. And then it's catastrophic. And then you get to the actual situation, which I did, and it was no big deal. And it was like, I let that and I had to fight it all Monday long. Wow. So I'm, and here's the bad thing. I'm self-aware enough to know it's happening. And it's almost worse because it's like, why can't I push this over? And I did. You know, I had a wonderful day. Actually, it's one of my, I told Adam, this is one of my better Sabbaths I've ever had. So in that sense, it was good. But then just when I was in a really good place, I just get this intrusive, yeah, but you need to take care of this thing.

21:16 Yes. So I'm pushing it off to the next day. So let's bring it back to when you're taking a Sabbath day. Can you play guitar? Is that okay? Can, you know, can I, can I code something on the Godcaster that I just got an idea? Like, because I always feel that's one of the most fun activities I have. Like, oh, I'm going to make this thing work or that thing work. I don't consider it to be work. Right, exactly. And that is the thing is when we went to the Sunscape Retreat Center out in Woodland Park, Colorado, we've been twice. We did it once and we did it one time. Then we did it 11 years later as kind of a reboot.

21:57 And they teach you about Sabbath. They teach you about being quiet. They teach you about being still and resting and restorative. So it's all being contemplative. It's all very good. It was life-saving for us. And one of the things they turned us on to a great book by Mark Buchanan. I can't remember, maybe God's Chosen Rest or something like that, or something like that. I could get the title because it's worth it. And it's about how to take a Sabbath. He's a busy pastor and he writes on these things. Great book. And so one of the things he said is do things that give you joy.

22:35 Do things that bring you joy that maybe you wouldn't do on a regular workday because you're thinking, no, that's a luxury, or that's I'm being extravagant or I'm being, there's always, there's another word for it I was looking for. But anyway, I'm being indulgent. That's the word. I'm being indulgent because this is just frivolous and fun. So when I pick up one of my guitars, one of my nine guitars hanging in my room at home and I plug in the amp and I turn it up and I put on some backing tracks that are like just some ACDC pastor. No, not really, but I used to do that. More, it's just music because it's backing tracks.

23:20 It's designed for this jam tracks. And I may play for an hour or two straight and not even blink. And I look up and go, whoa, two hours have passed and I've been playing and playing and playing. That brings me joy. It's cathartic. It's therapeutic for me. It restores my soul. And I always think of that line out of the 23rd Psalm: He restores my soul. And to me, Sabbath is about the restoration of your soul. So you find those things. And here's the beauty of it: to use a well-known phrase, no agenda. You really lean into the day with no agenda. And sometimes I nettle go, so what are you going to do today on your Sabbath?

24:02 I'm like, I don't know yet. Right. I haven't thought about it. Yeah. I'm trying not to think about it. Yeah. The thing I'm going to do the most is stay off my screens. I'm going to put down my screens and pick up my Bible. Yes. I'm going to go scripture before screens. And boy, I've been leaning into that. It's been life-giving. So for people who've maybe never even tried to take a Sabbath or whatever, first of all, the trick, the hardest part is carving out the time. Let's be real. Everybody's busy. Everybody has rhythms and routines that are established. Some of it just by necessity. You work five days. days a week, eight, nine hours a day.

24:43 When do you have a time to even do this? And that's where you got to get creative. Yeah. And I think that's where Sabbath moments are possible, where you just carve out, all right, I've got an hour and a half right here. Sabbath moments, I like that. Sabbath moments. That's a good one. You have to, especially if your job, your situation doesn't allow for a full day that you can literally take away. And some people are hardcore on this stuff. Like, oh, no, you got to do it anyway. You got to figure it. And I'm like, yeah, I think we're being too legalistic sometimes. So before I learned and actually sat down with my staff and told my board of directors, I would really like to take off a day of the week to have Sabbath.

25:33 I need that restoration. Nobody batted an eye. They're like, yeah, you should be doing that. I'm, oh, okay. Felt guilty for nothing. Yeah. So I get that luxury, but that's part of my part and parcel with being a pastor. And there's an expectation there. But for folks that don't have my job, they've got to find it. And it may be finding it in blocks of time and moments, but you've got to build it in on purpose. If you keep a schedule, which most people do. Maybe that's the way to do it. Like set a block of time and I'm going to do Sabbath. Should it be just like I would do, you know, a call or clean the grill, which I think could be part of my Sabbath because it does bring me.

26:16 This is what I've gone back to. He picks up his Bible, ladies and gentlemen. Oh, his agenda. There you go. There it is. There it is. I've gone back to this because I just put it in there. Now, it's going to be on there because my wife's going to make sure it's in there electronically so that it's beeping and learning. You're on paper now. I feel better. I've always felt better writing my schedule down. Wow. Because, too, you can write notes and different things. That's hardcore, brother. That's very analog of you. What can I say? I love it. Yeah. I love it. Tina's like that too. I'm not. I mean, I can't do to-do lists, all this stuff. My to-do list winds up being 8,000 pages long. I'm like, well, I'll put it on the to-do list.

26:57 And of course, and you've got to do what works for you. So for me, and most people do this, whether it's electronically or not, you know, I wrote in, what does that say? I don't have Sunday Sabbath. Sabbath, I see it. I wrote it for the whole day. Sabbath, all the way up. All the way down the page here. Yeah. And because if I don't schedule it, something else will get scheduled. Yeah. If I don't take care of my schedule, somebody else will. So I have to put it in my schedule. This is what I'm doing. Wow. I don't want to take the whole show for this, but I just feel like it's hopefully it's healthy. This was really good. It's good for me, too, because Sabbath moments and scheduling that time. And doing what brings life-giving? What is really restorative for you?

27:42 You know, you like to fish, go fishing. You like to hike, be outdoors. That's another thing. I love to get outdoors. And so it's good for me to get out in the sun. Yeah, that is. So I'll do that. Yeah. I got a prayer flare here for a good friend of mine. Well, good friend, a friend of mine. Everyone's passing this clip around. Everyone's talking about it. Everybody's excited. I wanted to play it. And then I wanted to discuss how we can pray for this man because everyone's like, Joe Rogan's going to church. This is fantastic. But if we really listen to what he's saying, I think we need to focus a lot of prayer towards Joe.

28:23 Because I'll be real honest. I want Joe in heaven because that would be fun. And Samson's waiting for him there to work out and stuff. So here's the clip that everyone's passing around. I haven't got that, but I have started going to church every now and again. Do you enjoy it? I love it. Yeah. I do too. It's a bunch of people that are going to try to make their lives better. They're trying to be a better person. And they're trying to, I mean, for me at least, the place that I go to, they read and analyze passages in the Bible. I'm really interested in what these people were trying to say because I don't think it's nothing. There's a lot of atheists and secular people that just like to dismiss Christianity as being foolish.

29:08 You know, it's just fairy tales. I hear that amongst self-professed, intelligent people. Like it's a fairy tale. I'm like, I don't know if that's true. I think there's more to it. I think it's history, but I think it's a confusing history. It's a confusing history because it was a long time ago. And it's people telling things in an oral tradition, then writing things down in a language that you don't understand in the context of a culture. culture that you don't understand. And I think there's something to what they're saying. I don't think it's nothing. No. No. I think there's something to it, and there's a reason why it resonates with people.

29:46 And Christianity in particular is the most fascinating to me because there's this one person that everybody agrees existed that somehow or another had the best plan for how human beings should interact with each other and behave and was the best example of it and even died in a nonviolent way, didn't even protest, died on the cross, supposedly for our sins. Like it's a fascinating story. What does it represent, though? That's the real thing. What was that? Like, what happened? Who was Jesus Christ if it was a human being? What was that? So Joe is very analytical.

30:25 Yes. And I think at the core, what I'm hearing, and this is consistent with him, when I professed my faith to him three years ago now, he said, I'm a Jesus freak, pretty much. He came, it's always the same. He says, he is not convinced that the word in the Bible is the word of God and set, and that that is it. He has huge distrust of that. And then I think that's where all of his analytical paths come from. It's like, well, let me just say that that was probably passed from an oral form, and then someone wrote it down that was translated.

31:08 He always comes up with Constantine and, you know, and the Bible was changed and stuff was left out and all of this. And that's actually not an atypical thought, even for believers, when you're out there on the internet and things pop up like, well, this was translated wrong, and the book of Enoch should have been in. And, you know, so I, and I preface this by saying, I want us to pray for Joe, but maybe you can just give your thoughts on what you hear him saying here. Well, I mean, it's obvious that Joe's been on a journey for a long time. I mean, I remember when Wesley Huff was on there, somebody put together a, it was actually fascinating, might have been when you were on there.

31:48 It was a series of all the people who've been. Well, it was a series of who come on, but also sort of his evolution, to use that word, you know, his transformation, his morphing. And it really is significant. I mean, he's made huge strides to where it wasn't that long ago when he would not have said anything he just said. Oh, no, he wouldn't. This is fairly recent. And to me, the way I look at it is, you know, I don't look at Joe as a project. Like, oh, we got to get Joe Rogan saved. Because if we do, I don't look at him as a means to an end and getting the gospel out with somebody who has a huge following like he does.

32:27 Which, right there, I'm sorry to interrupt. No, no. That's a big one. Yeah. Because everyone's like, if Joe Rogan comes to Christ, then this will be the best thing for the faith. And it's like, no, no, no, no. You're missing the point. God is not impressed with mass crowds. In fact, tonight, it reminds me what I'm going to talk about. I'm actually doing a fields of faith for Comfort Texas. I'm speaker, the guest speaker. Okay. So I get to preach a sermon to a bunch of teenagers tonight. Excellent. Nothing more intimidating on this planet than talking to teenagers, right?

33:05 You'll be seeing some looking at their phone. Oh, yeah, totally. Oh, that's totally. Oh, man. But I'm talking about Jesus, fan or follower. Are you a fan? Are you a follower? I like it. There's a lot of fans in the world right now. And even as with the Charlie Kirk thing, with all this stuff, you know, I'm Charlie Kirk, which I can't stand that phrase. But anyway, that's just a personal thing. I'm not Charlie Kirk. I'm Jimmy Pruitt, Jesus follower. Yeah. Jesus freak, whatever. So Jesus is very popular right now. Man, a year ago. He's trending. A year ago, it was looking bad for Jesus. He was not. I mean, his numbers are way down. You know what I'm saying? And now it's like,

33:48 I mean, we've seen a massive shift. I get excited about that, but let's be real about it. That does not impress God. He's not looking for likes and clicks. He's not looking for fans. And even the word follower, we're talking about biblical version of that, not the social media version of that, right? Which has always been a problem for me just as a non-believer. I'm like, follow, that sounds weird, but it is weird. Yeah. So to follow Jesus, that's what he's looking for. And so listen to this scripture in terms of that, because I think about Joe.

34:26 Right now, Joe is becoming a fan. He's not a follower. follower, but he's beginning to acknowledge there's something to this. There's more than I thought there was. I mean, even in his language, you can hear him leaning. It feels a little bit like he's looking at it as, although not a bad analog, the instruction manual to his car. It's like, right, right. I was like, well, Jesus, you know, he had this concepts. And if I live my life this way, it'll be better. Exactly. You nailed that. That's really, really what I heard too. Yeah. But I'm also happy for him that he's on the journey. Oh, yeah. That he's asking questions. He's asking good questions. He's asking questions.

35:10 That's number one. The tricky part for Joe and people like Joe, who are so analytical and linear in their thinking, is that they're going to struggle with the concept of faith and trust. Wow. Faith, trust, belief. They're all rooted in the same thing. They're going to struggle with that. And so it's interesting to me that I had a guy in my church. He became a lieutenant colonel. He became a colonel. I mean, this guy was like rising the ranks in the military. B-1 bomber pilot, one of the most Harvard graduate school of war.

35:50 I mean, this guy was General Petraeus' right-hand man in the desert in the sandbox. I mean, called me from a helicopter one time. I'm like, I can barely hear you. And you're on the other side of the world, somewhere hovering around one of the palaces of Hussein or whatever. So that guy had a, even though he was so brilliant, so analytical, the one thing he didn't have an issue with was trust, belief, and faith. He loved God. He trusted God. Still does to this day, by the way. He's still, he has a ministry now. He, you know, he retired out of the military, career, military. Now he has a ministry.

36:32 So there are people who are brilliant, intellectual, analytical, linear in their thinking who have no issue because this isn't an intelligence issue. Oh, absolutely not. But yes, some people would think it is, that the more intelligent you are, the harder time you're going to have with faith, trust, belief. No, that's not an intelligent issue. That's a heart issue. It's not a brain issue. It's a heart issue. And whether it's Joe Rogan or anybody else, they all have to come the same way everybody comes. That's through Jesus Christ. Jesus said, I am the way, the truth, and the life. And those who come to the Father must come by or through me.

37:14 But he's not a way, a true way. The way he the. Period. It is very exclusive. People say, so is Christianity exclusive? Absolutely. There is a way to get there, and it's through Jesus, and it's the way, not a. It's the. There's not multiple ways. And gosh, that just sounds very exclusive. It is. I didn't write the book. I didn't create the world. Oh, man, that's so good because you're right. That is, and I remember, because I also went, I approached my faith analytically. And, you know, for me, it was like, well, once I read,

37:53 what is the evidence that demands a verdict? And from there, it went into Beautiful Outlaw and all these other, you know, I think just having, and by the way, evidence that demands a verdict, like a third of that book is footnotes and, you know, location data. You know, this is exactly where this happened, that happened. Wow. I can just see a guy like Joe, trusting, having faith in something that is not his own doing because he worked out, because he ate this certain way. That's going to be really hard for him because his whole persona is kind of based on that.

38:36 And additionally, Joe has a photographic memory. People don't realize this. So he has to replace some of those pictures with new pictures. And that's what I'm praying for, actually. Well said. Well said. Somebody like Joe, who's a self-made man, pull yourself up by your own bootstraps. The hardest thing to surrender is yourself. Yeah. And that's the first thing Jesus asked for. He literally says this. Listen to how he says it. He says, if any of you wants to be my follower, you must give up your own way.

39:19 There it is. There it is. Take up your cross and follow me. It's Matthew 16, 24 in the NLT. So Jesus. Jesus said, you have to give up your own way. And that's the tipping point for everybody. And whether some people think, well, all the Jews will be saved, you know, because they're God's people. No, they have to come to Jesus. They have to come to God through Jesus, just like you and me. They don't get a pass. They don't get special preference. God wants them. He woos them. He sent Jesus to the Jews first. And the scripture even says to the Jew first, then the Gentile. So he came to them first.

39:55 And he's still there for them, even though initially they rejected him. But over a million Jewish people have professed Jesus Christ as Savior now across the earth. It's the most in history ever. Wow. So God's on the move. As land's moving, Jesus is showing up and it's happening. But every one of them, so the ground is level at the foot of the cross. There's no passes. I love that. The ground is level at the foot of the cross. That's good. Nobody gets a special pass because you're popular or because you have 12 million followers or whatever. At the end of the day, it comes down to the same thing. Like a child, you come to God and say, I can't do this.

40:38 I got to repent. I need you in my life. I give up. Max Lucato was his devotional this morning, which I heard on Hello Fred, available in the Godcaster. Get the Godcaster app for Android and iOS. He was saying, I wish I could recall it precisely, but that it's really in the hard times that God loves you the most and where you can really, that's where your faith really comes out. And by the way, that has a flip side. I always remind myself, thank you, God. Thank you, Jesus, for this wonderful thing that just happened. You know, we also have to rejoice in that.

41:19 But it's like you almost have to, although I didn't, I think, but going through a crisis is probably the way a lot of people come to faith. I don't know. Is that true? No doubt. You know, if you think about it, a lot of people go into Congress because of a crisis, right? It's the pain of staying the same has to outweigh the pain of change, my old boss used to say, Dave Ramsey. So think about it. The pain of staying the same has to outweigh the pain of change. We don't like change, and we don't usually change on purpose. We change because something happens. It's usually a result. Sadly, it's usually not the result of a good thing. It's usually the result of pain. Pain. So the pain of staying the same has to outweigh the pain of change.

42:04 So change is painful to people. And so a lot of times, whether you're the people that end up in Congress, unless they were born and raised into that world, and there are those elitist oligarchs. We've got those. But a lot of people that are serving in Congress, when you get behind the suit or the dress, they have a story. It's usually tragic. That's a good point. Yes, many do. And it drove them to do something they never thought they would do to get beyond their comfort zone. A lot of people that are like that in Congress, those are the ones I really got my eye on. Kind of like the old Will Rogers quote, I don't trust anyone who doesn't walk with a limp.

42:44 I don't trust a man who doesn't walk with a limp. So they're walking with a limp. And those are the ones who, I think, move the needle at the end of the day because they're not playing the political games. They're there for a reason, for a purpose. Same way with coming to Christ. A lot of times, we kind of have to hit the bottom a lot of times before we can really look up and go, I need help. I can't do this anymore. And that is interesting because it's still fresh enough for me. I'm reflecting on my own faith journey. I don't think Tina and I came to our faith or came to Jesus through any crisis per se. It was curiosity. It was,

43:27 maybe it was looking to fill something that we both felt we were missing. Not crisis, though. And I don't know if that's atypical. No, I don't think it is because I didn't come through crisis either. I came because I thought to myself, there's got to be more to life than what I'm seeing. I always think of the song is that, oh, there is my friend. And I think of the one by Stephen Kurz Chapman, more to this life. There's more to this life than living and dying. More than just trying to make it through another day. Yes. I love the lines in that song. Also available on Hello Fred on the Codcaster app. Download it today. Yeah, Android. Man, I really.

44:09 And, you know, it's like I'm hesitating because, and that's kind of why I wanted to do this. You know, maybe someone will send this to Joe so he can hear it. I don't want to be telling him what to do. do. Exactly. You know, I really, and this is probably the worst thing because I know people are like, Yeah, man, you know, we're ready for you. Jesus is ready. And no, like it's a touchdown. Yeah. We're not trying to score a touchdown. We're trying to see a life transformed. Yeah. So that he will spend eternity with Jesus, with God, with us. Yes. And so I learned very young not to make people projects. First of all, I learned that I can't talk anybody into coming to God. Right. If I do, that means somebody else can talk them out of it, right?

44:52 Whoa. It's got to be a real transformation of the heart. And I have nothing to do with that. Yeah. So as a pastor, I'm more a facilitator than anything. Even apologists, you know, who that's kind of their thing. They're brilliant. They're smart. They can talk you like a Wesley Huff who can really just break it all down for you. But at the end of the day, he can break it down for Joe. And Joe can go, yeah, those facts, that's interesting. Yeah, yeah, that Dead C Scroll thing and the Nassines and all that. Yeah, that makes sense. But at the end of the day, he still has to take what everybody has to take.

45:30 And it's a leap of faith. Just like Indiana Jones stepping out over that cliff and not knowing if there's going to be a stepping stone there or not. Yeah. Wow, that's good, brother. That's good. That's the real stuff. Yeah. Well, I'm praying for Joe that way. Yes. Because I really, I really, I really don't like the, as you say, like, yeah, we're scoring a touchdown. I notched it. Joe's a bio. Joe's. Let me notch my body. Joe's at the 20-yard line. You know, it's like, no, no, no, no, no. Wow, that's good. Man, I had a whole bunch of clips that we're not going to get to today. We may never. It was about Tucker Carlson at Turning Point USA. But Charlie Kirk has been kind of a theme throughout our episode here.

46:11 And I wanted to play one clip. It's about two and a half minutes long, but this is from one of our friends, Laura Logan. She went to Moscow to interview Kirill Dmitriev. And Kirill Dmitriev, when you hear him, you might recognize his voice. He is the counterpart to Steve Witkoff. So a serious guy. He runs the Sovereign Wealth Fund or Investment Fund, I think it's called, of Russia. And it's funny because Laura went to Moscow and he's been in the U.S. for like two weeks doing interviews everywhere. I'm not quite sure. I'm sure she's trying to set up something with Putin which would be on brand for her.

46:50 And I hope that works out. But it was such an interesting thing that he discussed because I know this is coming and I want our people. And when I say our people, our spiritual family here in Fredericksburg and anyone else who listens to this podcast, I'm most interested in them because they're our friends in our spiritual family. What's coming next is we're going to ramp up more Russia hate. We've already, you know, as you might have noticed that from the river to the sea has kind of disappeared and things are, you know, not that President Trump or his team will get any credit for that. That's, I don't think they care either. They just want to make the world a better place. I truly believe that.

47:29 So that's dying down a little bit. Now we're going to, you know, President Trump is really going to start working on Russia-Ukraine. And I myself went to Moscow in 1988 and found immediately these people are a lot like us. Yes. They have a lot of the same thinking and values, et cetera. It's true. And so I wanted to fortify our people here with some of the thinking, which I believe to be true, what Dmitriev is saying here, about how similar we are.

48:11 And so, and to recognize some of the things that to this day, many members of Congress and the House of Representatives and the Senate and leaders will be trying to convince you that this is the evil, evil Russia. And again, my mind was blown when I went there. So, you know, when we talk about Russia, you know, I've got in my mind that if I step off the plane, it's going to be in black and white. Precisely. I mean, that's how the narrative runs, and that they're all waiting in lines at grocery stores for a sack of potatoes. It's powerful imagery, brother. Powerful. And that's what I've seen for decades about it. But then the more as I've gotten older and realize it's very westernized.

48:52 Very colorful, in fact. Very much so. And just to kind of accentuate that, when I went to, it was still the USSR, but the wall had not come down. It was for the Moscow Music Peace Festival. And there was a very black and white part to it when, you know, so we had our big camera trucks and 24 cameras, and this big wire had to go into the KGB bus, which was literally. a gray bus with curtains. And it was completely black and white. That's your black and white vision. But then at 3 a.m., when we were hanging out in front of the hotel, because it was a bunch of Western rock guys, and the Moscow Hells Angels showed up, that was colorful, man.

49:31 That was like they're on Yava motorcycles. They're popping wheelies. And so, you know, that contrast is so incredibly real, but it's colorful. So just listen to what, and this goes all the way through what we're just coming out of of the Biden administration, really also going back to Obama and even further back when you think about it. I think it's just really informative to listen to this. Let me go back to how traditional values and other things unite us. Because President Putin has started talking about focus on traditional values, not this year, not five years ago, but when he really became president.

50:07 So for more than 20 years ago, he's been focused on really making sure that, you know, it's not a vogue world, it's a world where there is a man and a woman, a focus on the family, on Christian values. And I think that is very, very important. And he was calling out the fakeness of the vogue narrative for a long time. And by the way, just as President Trump. And by the way, a lot, I reposted one of your posts where you had this vogue vocabulary. People saying what they really mean. What they really mean. So I think the honesty and be straightforward, you know, not political correctness, but calling things the way they are is important. I would give another, I think, very poignant example of Charlie Kirk.

50:48 So Charlie Kirk really resonated with the Russian people. Isn't this fantastic? I really love that he brought this. I did not expect to hear that. I know you'd like it. And when this horrible tragedy happened, not only President Putin gave condolences, but the Russian church actually did an article recognizing Charlie King's Kirk's contributions to Christianity. So they see him not only as somebody who is an advocate of family, not only advocate on campuses, but really as a religious sort of thinker, the contemporary religious thinker. It's interesting because, of course, under Marxism, there is no room for religion. I mean, Karl Marx did not. He was a denialist when it came to God. I love that Laura does this. She's so good. Yeah, but Russia is actually quite a religious country.

51:31 Yes. So if you go, and I hope you can go to our Orthodox churches, etc., it's a very religious country and very much focused on values. So in reality, we see view the world very similarly, where we see, for example, immigration in Europe and what Biden tried to do in the U.S. as crazy. You know, I actually have a theory about this. I believe that Biden wanted Democrats to stay in power forever. So what he did, he figured out immigrants, criminals, and transgender, they were Democrats. So then he increased the number of criminals. He increased the number of immigrants. And there was a huge transgender spike, which is, by the way, now coming down, returned to normalcy during his era.

52:13 Turned to reality. All of that was to stay in power. All of those things that Russia is tough on, and Europe is not tough on. So I think another thing we see is, for example, Europe with allowing illegal immigration, with allowing lots of vogue policy. J.D. Van said it's basically suicide of European civilization. And we also see it very similarly. So to summarize, I think we all care about our families. We all care about the education of our children. We all care about having a good economy, good growth, and we are much more similar. And what happened during the Biden administration, and actually started with Obama-RussiaGate, is that RussiaGate tried to vilify President Trump, tried to vilify Russia.

52:55 And from that time, Russia became like really bad, bad, bad in the people's minds in the U.S. But more and more conservatives understand that those were fake, not true narratives. So I brought this clip because I wanted everyone to hear this, because when the messaging comes, which is going to come, about how evil it's going to be more focused on Putin. But I'm convinced, I have to say, I'm pretty convinced that President Trump and his team are working on something I call ARC, ARC, America, Russia, China. Notice that these are not countries with monarchies.

53:36 And I truly believe, and this whole interview, it's on the Godcaster at Bridge Church and the Godcast. And hello, Fred, as well. You can listen. It's 45 minutes, it's well worth it. That we are going to wind up working together and leaving each other in our own values. Like, China, you want to be like that? That's fine. But we can still, we do a lot of trade. I mean, that's our biggest trade partner. I mean, this is ridiculous not to recognize that. And Russia has a lot of what we need. when it comes to resources. But just listening to that, I'm like, listen, when the Russian church is thinking about Charlie Kirk, that blows my mind.

54:19 So when the messaging comes, I want people to think about this, that we are much more similar than the media, the control, it is completely controlled media, would have you believe. Man, I'm so glad you brought this up. You know, I've been doing a pushback on news, like almost to the point of, wait, if anything happens, what's going on? What's going on? I'm FOMO in a little bit because not even fear, though. It's not fear anymore. I'm just missing out because I want to. I'm choosing to fear. Choosing. I got to come up with a new thing. Chomo. Chomo. Choosing. No, that didn't work. No, that doesn't work. We'll figure something out. But, you know, I'm choosing to not swim in the cesspool of media right now.

55:01 And it has been hugely refreshing. But it also shifts your perspective. When you're not being fed this narrative constantly, these breadcrumbs and the narrative that start to add up and accumulate. And the algo starts to throw in your face. Exactly. It's like a cumulative GPA. You know, it just accumulates. And before you know it, you're toxic and you don't even know it. It's just frog in the kettle syndrome, right? So because I've been pushing back on that and not swimming in it, the stuff that's coming my way is almost laughable at this point. But it's stuff that a few weeks ago, I would have been like taking the bait. I would have been going, oh my gosh, did you hear about this?

55:43 So when I hear this, I'm not hearing it through a grid of a narrative that I've been swimming in. I'm hearing it fresh. Fresh, yes. Where I'm going, I completely see that. And I've heard that about Putin. Good things. People lose their mind if you say that. Like you said, this is going to spin up. For sure. We always need a nemesis. We need a antagonist. Let the true nemesis be our nemesis. Let their enemy be our enemy and not this. How can we teach the church, the public? I mean, I can say it till I'm blue in the face in the pulpit and they all nod and say amen, but then they come back next week full of this narrative.

56:25 It's like every week, I feel like I have to deprogram some of our people in our church. These are people I love and care about, but they're swimming in this. How can we help? I'm trying to lead the way by putting my screens down, picking up my Bible and talking about it. I think that's it. I mean, you're doing it. You are doing it. And it's, you know, how do people learn? Repetition. True. You know, you just keep repeating it, and you're very good at coming up with creative ways of saying the same thing over and over again. That's pretty much the life of a pastor. I'm sure that that's what you do for us. We have about one message. You just say it 7,000 different ways, creatively. And also, I think that's what our friends listening to this.

57:09 Even you and I are talking, but we're aware that there are other ears that are going to land on. And how can we encourage them, Adam Curry, to put down their screens, as you say, and pick up their Bibles so that when these narratives come down the pike and they are going to come, we go, I call, well, I'm not going to say it. I call BS something. My BS meter is going off because this doesn't align with what I think I know. Well, my rule of thumb is everything that media brings me, and that means mainstream media, but also social media, it's just by definition BS. I agree. 99% of it is going to be that you're not, there is no benefit.

57:54 There's also no loss. We got to come up with a, you're right. We've got to come up with a new acronym for phone. I'm not going to be anything to miss out. And I do this for a living, and I choose to miss out five of the seven days a week. And when I jump into it, I'm so fresh because you've got fresh eyes on this. This is all bullcrap. I can see it. And a fresh heart. Yes. Because you've been picking up your Bible. So your heart's getting reattuned to that. And it's, it's almost, well, I think this podcast, maybe, you know, because we didn't, we didn't do a business plan. We didn't sketch anything out. We said, it's time for us to do this because we get to do this.

58:36 And so I think this is a part of it. And I don't think long and hard. And, you know, it comes to me. You know, the Holy Spirit guides me. I'm like, oh, this is probably, I tag it. Like, this is probably good for the podcast. You have your own method. So I think it's just keep on rejecting the corridor to your brain, which is the notifications, et cetera, that screens. put down your screens, pick up your Bible, which is easy to say. I know it's not the easiest thing. And that in combination with booking your Sabbath time. And yeah, maybe it's just an hour.

59:16 Start with an hour, then do another hour. I'm saying this for myself, by the way, because I think it's a really good idea to put it on your calendar and then just see how just try. It's like, just try it. Try not looking at your phone for an hour. Then try two hours. Then try. This is the easiest. This I can do. I can literally not look at my phone for X amount of time. You'll see the improvement and just maybe take stock at the end of the day. Was this really something that was so outrageous? I needed to know this. You know, write down all the things you learned that are super important. I guarantee you can't. You forget. You don't even know what all the important things that got y'all worked up.

59:59 It's not going to be there. And ask why. Why do I need to look at it? But also, why do I need to post? Oh, this has been a huge thing for me. You've helped me with it. I told Annette, I said, I'm so thankful for Adam, our friendship, because you've beat this drum for a long time with me. Not like trying to get me to do anything. It's just we've been talking out loud. We just happened to hit record today, but this conversation would have happened anyway. It's an ongoing conversation. Normal dialogue is. They're just letting people listen in. But we've talked about this before, and it's helped me because it got me thinking, why am I posting this?

1:00:39 Am I posting this to be seen? Now, here's the thing that happens, and anyone who starts down this road is going to realize it. It changes your filter, it changes your lens. So you're going to start noticing friends that they're posting because they're wanting people to pay attention to them. That's it. And it's this need to be seen, need to be noticed, need to be recognized. And that includes commenting. It even includes hitting the like button. All of that is narcissism. You know what I found out? When I just put my screen down, and I'm gaining about an hour a morning right now. Oh, because usually I'll post. I'm just being transparent. Yeah, you post.

1:01:24 Then I wait to see who. And I've just stopped doing that. Because now, because I'm not posting anything else, I'm not posting my picture of my steak, picture of my new awesome thermometer, the meter. You know, normally I was thinking about this the other day. I'm out there with my meter using it for the first time, and I thought, I should take a picture of that. And I thought, why? Why? Why? Why? It's because I want people to go, that's cool. Yeah. And listen, I know not all of it's nefarious. I mean, let's just be real. We want to communicate and be a community with people. So it's not all bad.

1:02:03 And sometimes I think I come off sounding that way, but it's not. Sometimes I think it's cool to post your kids' first day going to school or your kid got an A on a on a paper. I don't, because you got grandparents looking at you got aunts and uncles and cousins looking at your account. So I don't think it's all bad when it's actually social media, but it's turned into something else. It's turned into what I call performance media. Yep. Yep. And so I think that's, I love what you just said there because it really resonated with me. Is I'm just starting to ask, why am I doing this? And that stopped about 99% of me posting, honestly.