Monday, 16 February 2026

Jeff Davis With Sheila Martin Waco Siege Survivor [C2BZyt1OXNc]

A survivor of the Mount Carmel Center fire recounts the final moments of the federal siege and the spiritual journey of her Harvard-educated husband.

Waco siege Sheila Martin Branch Davidians Mount Carmel David Koresh Wayne Martin

By Mike Hanson Archives | 7m listen | 4 chapters

RSS Transcript

Jeff Davis With Sheila Martin Waco Siege Survivor [C2BZyt1OXNc] cover

About this episode

Sheila Martin, a survivor of the 1993 Mount Carmel Center fire, marks the anniversary of the Waco siege by detailing the final moments of the Branch Davidian community. Martin recounts the physical sensation of the flames and the suffocation that claimed her husband and children during the federal standoff in Texas. Her testimony provides a rare perspective on the internal life of the group led by David Koresh and the enduring grief of those who escaped the compound.

Wayne Martin, a Harvard-educated lawyer, transitioned from Seventh-day Adventism to the Branch Davidians in 1985, eventually managing legal affairs and visas for the community. Sheila Martin describes her husband's final phone call from a police station, where he urged a federal agent to seek a relationship with Christ. The narrative includes collaborations with professors from Baylor University and Louisiana to document these events in the memoir When They Were Mine. This record utilizes therapeutic drawings to capture scenes of trauma that words alone could not convey.

Sheila Martin reflects on the surreal experience of watching surviving children reach adulthood while her own family remains frozen in the tragedy of April 19. Her account balances the professional background of her late husband with the spiritual convictions that drew them to Mount Carmel. This conversation serves as a somber retrospective on the intersection of faith, law, and the catastrophic failure of the federal siege.

CHAPTER 01 / 4 Discussion

Sheila Martin Reflects on the Mount Carmel Center Tragedy

Sheila Martin, a survivor of the Branch Davidian community, reflects on the 17th anniversary of the fire at the Mount Carmel Center in Waco, Texas. She describes the emotional weight of seeing surviving children reach adulthood while mourning the family members and children who died on April 19, 1993. Martin recounts the physical sensation of the fire and the enduring grief of losing her husband and children to suffocation and flames during the federal siege.

sheila martin· mount carmel· branch davidians· waco siege· anniversary

00:00 And we're visiting here with Branch Davidius Sheila Martin. Sheila, thank you so much for coming on. First off I want to give you the opportunity to say whatever you want to say about on this special day here. This is what 17 years from the day that Mount Carmel went up in smoke and tell us about your home? Well i think when we see the children that did survive and see that they are now in their 20s and 30s, you realize that all the others that were that age 17 years ago those would be young men or women lives. That they would have had some kind of schooling and jobs and getting things together and having a life like we have. We've had chance to buy homes and buy cars go to stores and do things

00:50 and thankful for what God has given us but still our hearts always want to think that somebody is beside us, the child that you bore or the husband that you married. You want them to be a part of this whole experience and your thankful for all the things people have done for you but there's that part of you that knows it Those who died way back in 1993, on April 19th. They didn't have a chance they suffocated Those first few days I felt the fire on my back. As they turned away from the fire, as they were breathing in it...I felt my lungs just filling with this... I felt so close to them being in that building and all that consumption or whatever. And even though each year you're thankful for what God has done is part of it is so painful for what has happened

CHAPTER 02 / 4 Discussion

Sheila Martin Discusses Her Memoir and Branch Davidian Life

Sheila Martin details the creation of her book, "When They Were Mine: Memoirs of a Branch Davidian Wife and Mother," which was developed with assistance from professors at Baylor University and Louisiana. The memoir covers her initial introduction to Seventh-day Adventism, her life at Mount Carmel, and the traumatic events of the 1993 siege. Martin explains how she used drawing as a therapeutic tool to document painful scenes from the siege while processing her grief and religious faith.

sheila martin· memoirs· branch davidians· baylor university· seventh-day adventist

01:46 And you're reminded every year even more so just listening to the names. Yeah, see the faces and you get to see on the other pieces of other people they have a joy Tell us about your book you it's when they were mine I memoirs of a Branch Davidian wife and mother, Sheila Martin. Tell us about this. Well many years ago we were approached by a lady from Louisiana, a professor there and people from Baylor they all came together and said do you think he'd like to? And we're thinking well we're hoping soon God is coming in the book doesn't have to be done because it's painful and you don't want remember all those things thankfully as time goes on

02:37 you're able to deal with what has happened, then you can listen a little bit more in your heart about what has happened who's died the tragedy and you can bear the fact that they're not with you. But I found that as i was reading and writing things and going over things I was reliving everything. You remember that first day when sense that they were gone, they weren't coming back. There was no Mount Cumber to go back to there's nobody calling you on the phone and they were not alive anymore And you found yourself wondering how are we going live? How are you gonna deal with it because God has always been there for you You say well I can get through it but thankfully years have passed But you can get through this and as me we're getting through all of the different things with the book

03:29 We knew that we went from the very beginning to the times when we had a husband and children, and then into life at Naucano. And then you experience fire in all these different things. It's just that hope that you are going be able go on each day trusting God and hopefully see them all again. That is what this book is about, the whole situation from how I first met Seventh-day Adventist David and all these different things. And this is what this book is about, and it has pictures also in the middle of pictures that I've drawn about the people and there's different experiences like...I wanted to remember them some of the things that some of the people or some of the situations

04:17 experience while it was during the siege and so I thought the best thing would do is to just draw some things. And, I'd get up in the middle of the night sometimes I was drawing things and going how am i drawing these scenes that have been so painful for me? And, I'm able to actually doing them without breaking down as some of them were overwhelming yet at same time God helping me Yeah, tell us about Mr. Wayne Barth. First of all most people remember him as being a lawyer from Harvard He did so many things for David, for different people in Mount Carmel. For whatever they needed some kind of counsel for we took people up to Dallas even to help them with their visas and getting back and forth in the country there was all kinds of ways that he was able to use the expertise that he had from being in Harvard and from the time when went to North Carolina coming to Texas going into the bar and passing the bar exam

CHAPTER 03 / 4 Discussion

Wayne Martin and His Transition to the Branch Davidians

Wayne Martin, a Harvard-educated lawyer, initially resisted the Branch Davidian teachings before eventually moving to Texas in 1985 to join the community. Sheila Martin describes her husband's professional background, his work assisting community members with legal issues and visas, and his eventual spiritual bond with David Koresh. She recounts a final phone conversation from the police station where Wayne urged a federal agent to seek a relationship with Christ and study the Bible.

wayne martin· david koresh· harvard law· waco· religious conversion

05:21 He was the guy who didn't want this at first. He wanted me, but not this truth But as time went on and he met David and saw David as being a person who is not overbearing Who was willing to listen it made him think well maybe I can listen to this guy a little bit more Maybe I can read the Bible and listened to him and see where two things were Not just listened to him and not have any other situation To fall back on and little by little if he was willing to come here in Texas, in 85 we moved here and he just grew. I saw him grow and it was like David said this is his turn now to have the experience. I had known these people about these people here in Waco for 20 or more years so It was his turn. It was great to see him want... And mostly the thing that I remember when I came out of El Camo on the day they brought us downtown to Waco to the police station

06:17 I spoke to the agent, asked him could i speak to Wayne. He said yes and got him on the phone. I said Hi Wayne how are you? The kids are fine and he said let me speak to that agent Let him know that in my heart need this agent to know the most important thing he could ever have is a new relationship with Christ. He needed to know that Bible was important And I've kept that with me So that my heart is heavy, but I remember my husband as being a person who loved the Lord and loved the Word. And wanted other people to know. And I'm not afraid of life because of that little five minutes when I sat an watched him. I knew my husband would be fine when he was with God and he was going to trust God for everything

CHAPTER 04 / 4 Discussion

Conclusion of Interview with Sheila Martin

The interview concludes with a final promotion of Sheila Martin's memoir regarding her life as a Branch Davidian wife and mother. The host offers well wishes for the book's success and thanks Martin for sharing her perspective on the anniversary of the Mount Carmel tragedy.

sheila martin· book promotion· memoir· waco· branch davidians

07:10 I wish you the best success with it. Thank you so very much, thank you. I appreciate it very much. Thank you right here folks. Sheila Martin Memoirs of a Branch Davidian Wife and Mother