Following Your Inner Purpose with Film Producer Nic Askew

00:00 In this episode of the Team Superdad podcast, I talk with accidental business leader Amazon Adventurer and film producing soul biographer Nic Askew who is also a dad. Roll theme! Welcome to Team Superdad. Real dads creating their best lives ever, more time more money more fun you are not alone! You're on Team Superdad. Hello and welcome to the team super dad podcast my name is Jonnie welcome if you're here for the first time of course welcome and if you come back then I must be doing something right because you're here again we are talking

00:41 Everything to do with being a great dad, you know busy dads. We are working hard we are trying to make the most of our family time, we're trying to make money keep fit the whole shebang and yeah it's tricky so in Team Superdad we're all about the support and community to make those things happen whether it's from me whether it's from other dads in the group whether it's from expert coaches and specialists that we have On all our events apart of the F5 and Hero Academy then welcome. I'd love to get you more involved but today it's about the podcast and we are talking to a really cool bloke, a guy called Nic Askew and you'll hear more about him as we get into the conversation but i've known Nic for a long time and Nic...I'll tell you about this because he doesn't do very good job at the beginning in the podcast He is amazing film producer

01:31 produced his soul biographies, these amazing like they really just stop you in your tracks. They're black and white it's one person and they're just talking and it sounds like not really much how much fun could that be right? But is quite striking in the extreme and Nic has been Roger Black, YouTube Creator The team they've created there, the unity they've created there and as I'm sure you'll hear from Nic's conversation just how much he trusted his heart and his instinct. Where other people have thoughts that are perhaps stopped by them or oh if that could happen or if that makes sense, Nic over and over again has gone for it

02:32 And it's a really powerful example of what's possible by following, perhaps that inner voice or perhaps that destiny. Depending on your persuasion it could be following God's word whoever your god is to you Nick's just been out there and done it. And, and there are times in this conversation... It's a really chilled-out conversation okay so if you're operating heavy machinery or driving late at night this might not be the one because Nic is just he's just a great guy to listen to some of it is really thought provoking and will actually expand So, Jonnie Jensen, welcome.

03:25 And Nic is exactly the kind of people that I love to be around. I've known him a number of years as you'll hear and, and...I've shared this before but just staying in touch with people You don't have to speak them every day, you don't have to speak them every week, you don't even have to speak to them every six months But like once a year just make an effort To reach out and check in with people People who were friends with, people who struck a chord with you, people you had laughed with People you loved, like really we only live on this earth once and if you're a good person if there's people in this world who've touched your heart expanded your mind who you've had great times with then don't just let them drift away into the darkness of it all. Keep in touch and then you could have great conversations like this one with Nic

04:17 If you're interested in everything we do here at Team Superdad, well come on over to teamsuperdad.com or visit the group over on Facebook that's facebook.com forward slash groups forwards slash TeamSuperDad I won't tell you anything more about that this week suffice to say it is awesome if your a dad and want some unity some Good evening Nic, lovely to have you here on the Team Superdad Podcast. Yeah good late afternoon and

05:17 You're getting quite old now, like we may end up going to bed at different times. Which in reality probably means that they'll end up going to bed after me in not too long! Our kids go to bed after us all the time now and it's because they are of that age so they're not that old but I think we probably go to bed early In fact this house... At the moment I'm not in the studio since Covid-19 I kind of tend to be in the house So I'm in the attic and We have one, we've set up a homeschool. Yeah So we've got to teach her and we got two teachers actually who come in and they the school is in our carport so we can four eleven-year old boys

05:59 So three from other families. Yeah, yeah And they're all podding together and they're outdoors We've got this carport which is like a garage without the ends so it's kind of you know there's a breeze going through and we live by creek and they run down to the creek in between any bit of work and they bounce on a trampoline then they come back and they learn art, and they play guitars and harmonicas. And they run around... and the science stuff as well so it's pretty cool! Then we have one who is going to school half of time and she at the moment is doing ballet on the first floor or on the ground floor. She's a ballerina and the whole place has taken over. And then on the floor above that we've got another one finishing up her

06:40 Schooling day online. So the whole house is totally and utterly every single square foot is used for something Wow, it's It's not mad actually it's quite good but occasionally it feels like there are a few too many people in the house Oh and the animals! I haven't talked about the animals either Luckily I've managed to bar the door so I'm not sure we're gonna get cats and dogs up here Well that is Wonderful insight into some of the madness and you're in where about Minneapolis? Minneapolis has recently become known probably for the wrong things, but it's not all that. Yeah And so geographically for those that don't know whereabouts in the States is there? In the middle near the top on the Canadian border Okay So when I first moved from London It was kind of random

07:29 People say, where are you going? And I go Minneapolis and they go mini-where. And I just go no not mini-where Nelly Canada so yeah I live in Nelly Canada. Yeah well Nick you and I met we were talking about before we press live we met in around about 2006 something like that and the reason why it's so great to have you on the Team Stupider podcast is that over the last 15 or so years And So, I'm going to start with a question that's been asked quite a bit. And it is from a person who has a very interesting story and I think we've all heard this before in the past. It's about a man who was on his way home from work and he had a dream where he saw a house

08:37 Get busy, we get married. We have the kids to work kind of like so many pressures come along and before we know it that vision that we had seems to kinda shrink it seems to get a little bit further out our reach but the frustration of being out our reach actually grows and you know in my work with Team Superdad In my own journey myself I really understand that And having you here this evening as someone...I can't wait to talk about your work and everything you do So, when we first met, you were like London Agency life weren't you? Working in media or something. Kind of I never started off like that so

09:36 I was an adventurer, so an explorer of sorts. So I canoed the Congo and the Amazon then across the Sahara Sorry we've got aeroplanes that's uh That's a trouble with you get a good mic and then the airplanes come across anyway, but like you're right i did work in the London marketing scene I guess you know In fact I did end up running a company called Mintel big market research company or The International Arm for that Awful for me. It was a great, great job for someone just not for myself Do you think it was Alex at Lycos who introduced us or Tim at Tequila that introduced us? Alex Kovacs at Lycos, Tim Bonnet at Tequila Oh Tim Bonet sounds familiar Yeah Anyway I wasn't really into all of that and even actually I became

10:29 Chief executive of a company in the Hays Group, which is one of the biggest companies in the country for four days. And so I'd left Mintel because I realized it wasn't for me and it had been against my better judgment and I'd gone off to Central America then I came back and The Headhunters knocked on the door And they said we got these ideal things for you and I said, I'm not sure. Not sure what I want anyway, I got persuaded against my better judgment yet again and I went in and I was chief exec of my job was going to be buying these companies sounds me make it makes me sound like

11:12 I don't know, it's like...I can't even touch that time. It was so long ago. Like you're a business dude? Yeah! Like I was a business dude and never was, you know what? I loved hanging out with people or that's what was great but I suppose in the absence of not knowing what to do everyone else I knew is kind of in that so I was doing it and then I resigned on the fourth day and said well I think you know as I said to the chief exec of the group I think you know you persuaded me and I probably shouldn't have said yes So take your car, you don't need to pay me anything and I took the train back to London. And my job was going to be buying companies which sounds absurd because I wouldn't know how to buy a company. Yeah! Then then I was just wondering... You know? I was doing lots of stuff bits and pieces and I'd never really done anything artistic in my life. Yeah! I taught myself guitar and I loved that but I always imagined

12:08 And I wasn't really cognizant of anything like that. And then film appeared, and we were talking earlier... The most fascinating thing that I pieced together before what I did know when I realized what the dream was and it was a really quite ethereal dream in that I wasn't looking for it at all so I was sitting in the Chancery Court Hotel in London in Hoban Minding my own business, not thinking about anything. I wasn't trying to work anything out...I wasn't even looking and then suddenly out of the ether comes this idea that it didn't have words but if it had words it said you have to pick a camera up which is odd because I didn't have a camera. I'd never really touched a video camera. I wouldn't know what to point at. I wouldn't know what to make films about or in service of what or what route to take even how to work one

13:12 But I knew enough to know what knowing is versus wanting something or believing it. That's very, very different. Knowing is always like this feeling that possesses you almost like you can't question it. You know it will be... It's almost like the question disappears. We're talking about an instinct, a sixth sense, a gut-like... Oh yeah absolutely! From far beyond left field So there was no stimulus, there was no outside stimulus. I wasn't admiring someone who is a filmmaker... ...I wasn't looking at a camera or anything so there was nothing that provoked it in the physical world. Nothing! I've come to understand that well now

14:01 But nothing, you know there was no conversation leading up to it. It was totally and utterly what you might call random as I think about it yeah it's kind of random. I always describe it is like out of the ether. It just suddenly occurred and I knew but of course when that happens it doesn't come with any instructions. It doesn't come with a business plan or why which is in the context of your group, your dads was a really quite inconvenient time because we just had our first kid, you know she was probably not even one.

14:41 And you know, so we got a family in London living in Clapham and it's like I've got to do this weird thing. I've gotta go pick a camera. I actually walked around someone's house and borrowed their video camera knocked on the door. It was more like that, you know? Like if is very small and cheap and almost like an iPhone one had a better lens way before iPhones. Yeah yeah yeah. It was actually before YouTube started Let's just let's just frame this whole conversation right because I think it'd be really helpful for people listening to watching might sound a bit weird But let's just jump right to now. All right, you've you've made how many films? You've you know featured how many people we know like what where's this journey taking you right now well Just to frame if yeah, there's like like the same some random geezer. I'm chatting too. This is hey Yeah, so well What it

15:37 I've come to work out retrospectively what this is. And it's mysterious as can be, utterly mysterious and it always was if I think back to it and so I've made films except of course they're not really films there you might look at them and go well they are human portraits deeply considered human portraits of people very close up physically close up, like almost like the framing we have here but maybe even closer. You know that the MO of it is I sit with someone usually only about a meter away very close and i have nothing to ask them nothing! I don't have any questions and so you know if I were filming you for example we'd sit in a room um...and I wouldn't have given you any briefing notes there was no context apart from the fact your Jonnie or you think your Jonnie

16:39 And my job is to see you beyond all the ideas you could possibly hold about yourself. I worked out the best way to do that was just to sit there and so, I would sit there and they were just be silence and quiet it was the complete opposite of an interview. I came to understand that the world is full of words Mostly that have some kind of attachment to them. So, you know here we are on a podcast and wouldn't it be great if I could tell you guys a load of stories and I could create this wonderful myth of this chap called Nic

17:23 Who is really good at doing what he does, you know films and other things. And maybe you could pass the word on or subscribe to The Weekly Films or buy something off me Or just give me some kind of affirmation that I'm okay You see words they usually come out and they usually need something They need some result in the world and that becomes very evident when you make film and your present to someone You know, in other words there's no analysis or anything. There is just a stillness and then you look at it back in the edit you notice its binary most words in the world come from that place I just described but there is this moment where all that goes away and almost instead of someone talking to you or at you It's almost like they're spoken so the words have come from a very different place

18:23 And people don't even know what they're going to say. It's come from, you know I would say deep inside or maybe even beyond that and people stumble through their sentences and they start sentences and they have no idea what's on... gonna be near the full stop in that particular sentence let alone on the far side of the full stop totally and utterly unguarded. And what tends to happen is the most extraordinary thing People reveal themselves Because their guard has dropped or there was no guard in the first place. There is no guard, it wasn't dropped it just wasn't there. It allows them to see deeper into what they want to say rather than what they've... I guess in conversations we show quite a lot of we put up on our facade and we say people wants to hear Yeah! I had a wonderful example few years ago where this

19:19 I was filming by accident somewhere because i was asked to go and look at some leadership institutes work and give my observation about you know what they were doing with the work. And stuff, but I just happened to have my cameras there in the guy in charge said that would you bring your cameras out? And I tend to film live with a feed from the camera projected onto our screen cinema screen so there's nowhere to hide You know, your face fills one side of the room. So there's nowhere to hide metaphorically and physically as well And so the invitation was there and someone marches up to the chair this kind of elderly-ish guy wonderful guy called Ted I didn't know who he was no one over those days had said what they did or who they were really

20:07 And he sits there and he starts talking, and I recognise where the words come from. I just have to go Ted, let's just not do that. He goes what you mean? I say look...I tend to love to get this shot of people with their eyes closed Just very still You know I love the photography of that, I love the image in film as well Of just peace kind-of So lets start there It turns out he was a US Congressman And he'd started, and I kind of worked that out along the way because he had started to talk about these kinds of liberal ideals which sounded wonderful but they were still a stump speech as they say. It was still words put into the world in service of other people which is still had a need attached them and I just said look you can

20:59 Sit there Ted, just sit there. If you don't even open your eyes and you don't even say a word I think that will be enough and I mean it because i'm not looking for anything...I don't require anything from anyone in these instances so there's no one to fix There is no story to tell that must be told There's nothing to get off your chest Nothing to remedy There's no contribution you have to make to the world And those are almost the conditions, so almost like a nothingness. Kind of seem to have these conditions of what you might call presence which isn't something you can do it's not I'll be a bit more present or I'll hold space Space doesn't need holding Space is just there You know this is mysterious but life is just mysterious It just is and so in that particular instance as in virtually every instance

22:03 This character sits in the chair and he's kind of a little shocked of, well this person doesn't need anything out to me. What should I do? And then he starts trembling and then the words that come out are quite extraordinary spellbinding and he'd never said them before and you know people in...people in the room were also quaking and crying and like where the words had come from was somewhere really deep That's how you see a human soul. It is really simple, it is nothing As soon as you interject any notion of the world needs to be different or you need to remedy something You need to be someone, you need to contribute here Your participation is contingent on you offering something here

23:02 Then you won't see someone. You'll see what you think is someone, you'll see a guy called Jonnie who's got a story which we can all... many of us can look at and go oh yeah I think well we don't really see you not really and it's a stark difference And so I hadn't worked that out actually I just kind of did it naturally largely because it seemed well if you're going to see someone why would you ask a question? Because then again answer the question and then all I can see as their words And then people seem to, certainly more now than in the early days. People seem to be almost liberated just for something to come through them and so I realized... So I make films out of those to put context in you know that I've always made films out of that this simplicity of that and they are terrifying to people

23:59 They are hard to pay attention to. Attention is the key quality that most people miss everywhere, like full attention, unbridled attention You can probably appreciate that with kids you know if you don't give them full attention they're gonna be...they know and I think it's this full attention thing is probably the greatest gift we don't give each other Yeah, we don't listen. We don't... People talk and we don't listen! We're working out what to say next Well yeah not even that but even when we're not trying to work out what to say we're trying to work out what they are saying. We were actually listening and listening as most people understand it is a verb which we doing something but to do nothing No thing is the most extraordinary thing It's almost I wrote a poem once so should probably read it you I'll see if I can get one more

24:57 And just whilst you're doing that, the movies you've made over the last 15 years through the period of time when it was soul biographies and now on to The Point Of Us. You know, these films are spellbinding. You said terrifying I think the intensity of some of them could be but they're also spellbinding this you know there's a reason why you're in black and white if people are wondering why Nick is in black and white if you watching on the live stream all his films are shot in black and white with this light casting across some part as a shot or the person

25:41 And it is just them talking. It's just, and you've done this throughout the world You've been invited to do it if you've traveled yourself and found people that there's so much There's more practical side to what you've been out there doing in the world as well And it has touched so many people in different places and revealed so much about those communities Well thats the thing What I realized was happening Before your words of encouragement and well-timed advice, before items gifted at beyond an arm's length did you ever consider the one thing that might turn the entire world on its axis?

26:44 You're undivided and so still attention. And I don't think, I know that essentially that's what was offered with the camera. Here we are...I'm not going to direct this anywhere because this would seem enough you know my overwhelming desire is for people it is strange all I found myself saying When people would come along for, you know long periods of time to sit with a camera and stuff because it I suddenly realized it was revealing some sense of truth out of people. People found it oddly really easy To say things that they never even imagined could be said and yet there could be 100 people in room or 500 people in a room Or 10 people but it would just come out It was like they were being spoken And...I realized

27:48 In some respect, it was letting truth come out. Truth be recognized in a way and not empirical truth you know right and wrong is beyond the right and wrong but it's this sense of something that once said was realized then you can't unsee it And so I got myself in many situations where I'd either be, you know commissioned as a filmmaker to make a film on conflict or schizophrenia or education or something. Where the job was to go yeah i know this is what you studied or this is your experience but really what if you were to sit there? What would you say and then we'd sit there and then out would come words riding on emotion which could be felt on film

28:37 And so that was really interesting. And is it because it's disarming? Or is it because people are actually given that space for the first time ever, maybe to look inside to, to be silent and think maybe in the same way that you had your calling to pick the camera up there left in a moment where they go Oh I've got to say something I've gotta say something and then It's such a disarming moment The first time ever maybe their real words come out, the thing they've always wanted to say starts to come out. Yeah well I think both are probably true disarming in the fact that people aren't used to being with someone who doesn't need anything from them. I mean even I remember making a film in a hospice in DC

29:27 And The Hospice specialized, because they did specialize in African-American homeless men with AIDS. You know the niche? Yeah But no one wanted them you know no one wanted to be around them and so they set up this extraordinary thing and I remember making this film and I spent kind of three days there it was amazing but i remember the real predicament of The Hospice and I suppose was that they get a lot of volunteers to come to work and people, staff to come to work. But it's very difficult to sit with the dying person and for it to be okay so what people do is they sit there very still but they want the person to live They want to... And so there's no peace So there's still something There's tension absolutely and its not about the dying person

30:24 The dying person usually just going, please leave me in peace. I know i'm dying and i've come to terms with it and there's someone do-gooder in you know that maybe that's being a little unkind but that was...that goes on. They don't mean to be do-gooder but by virtue of being there and creating tension they are a do-gooder well intended do-gooder So could you sit with someone? And want nothing different like could I sit with you until the end of this podcast or till the end of time And we don't even speak, would that be enough? I believe it would. There are times where nothing needs to be added and it's okay and that's disarming in a way that is comparatively to the normal minutes and hours and days you spend It's not useful. Then you asked another part of that... I did start to understand

31:29 And this is the contrarian nature of this and this is why it's so, in some respects so very difficult to have someone understand this because its antithetical to almost everything. I realised that was nothing... no thing So when I would teach this and I'd teach the camera method if you like as a way for people And I would always say, well there's nothing to this. There is actually nothing to be done because it is the absence of everything that gives

32:07 that allows the liberation as soon as you start any sense of interview or even thought, oh poor you. You know I know your bio, what a terrible time those early years divorce and stuff must have been and the possibility...I'm thinking about this thing Even that shuts someone down to what i am talking about utterly But how would I know what you want, what you need, what you require? What's needed here and as i started to do that. I realized... What was witnessing so it would look like there's a guy called Nic who is very still and actually really good at listening. I'm not listening! Listening is a verb, listening is an act every act that happens gets in the way The witness is the thing we're sitting in its presence itself

33:03 I mean, that's mysterious in itself. But that is what is here. It's what we're in people call it all sorts of things space People love to say... In fact someone said to me once Oh! I got it you must be really good at holding space. At first they were trying to work out and people always try to work out how this works And they go, you've just got to be. I go no-no-no! You don't just gotta be that's just something to do and it is very de rigueur and of the moment but thats' just something that you also don't need to do. Your off the hook on that. Then that same person said oh so you must really good at holding space. Go No! Space doesn't need to held. Space is here we're in it not only are we part of it we dont need to hold it your off the hook as well there nothing to do here with nothing to do

33:57 It feels utterly different. There's nothing to do in this moment, I mean there is stuff to do but in this moment...I'm not trying to push you anywhere! I am not trying to serve you or help you. There just almost like bristling unbridled presence That's the most amazing thing Actually, I need to dig something else out because what I realized was that how I picked up the camera in first place The absence of action

34:34 So I've got this friend called Simon Sinek who wrote a book called Start With Why and we once gave a lecture years ago, 12 years ago at MIT. And he did his very early start with why lectures on first and I followed him and I remember why is a wonderful concept Just is, you know it's practical. It doesn't just inch people forward suddenly people have a sense of purpose You know I've worked out why i'm doing this and I remember looking at the crowd It was the MIT Entrepreneurial Forum and everyone was writing copious notes. It's useful man if we could only answer why We could give it to marketing And then they could do their work

35:23 You know, wrap up an omission statement and whatever. Of course I come out and think that I'm a bit contrarian. I was just genuinely interested in this kind of wow everyone's trying to write it down To me why would seem like better lived as a state? A state of how you are in the world How you move through the world It's not a verb, its not something that you answer Not even a question, you don't answer it But then I come to understand That The thing that happened to me In that hotel with film was I wasn't looking and something found me. So, I wasn't paying attention to anything. I wasn't trying to work anything out. I wasn't doing anything And maybe a decade ago...I'm just going look for this thing A decade ago I wrote this poem called The Tree of Dreams and I kind of quite liked it It's kinda simple and that I just had this character in mind then I didn't realize really the character I didn't realize the character is me

36:28 Metaphorically in some sense. And so I'll read you that because, anyone who's listening...I know it's late over there so maybe they'll listen to the podcast but if you are looking for purpose and your looking for your why if you like, why you exist what you're doing here What is your contribution? What's your legacy and stuff? I have an idea You might be doing the very wrong thing Because I have this idea that if you want to seek, if you want to look something will find you. So I wrote this kind of metaphorical poem and it's called The Tree Of Dreams and goes like this Many had gathered under the tree of dreams All but one stood shaking its branches for dreams to fall Dreams that had been whispered to them by the voices of others Dreams that would fade with time

37:29 But one sat quietly, waiting for a dream to recognize his soul and to consume him with no doubt. And I'm thinking that life does have this capacity to almost... To recognize you, to find you as opposed to you find it and we are so inculturated into our life of control, our life over there Everything you look at shouts almost, if it had a voice it would shout. You're not quite enough! You should be doing this slightly differently...you could have this or look over here well this and nothing's ever enough including oneself and I realized that in those moments of utter presence people realize that wasn't true And they were found and talking about myself as well absolutely myself. I'm found

38:34 And suddenly there's this extraordinary life, almost like a make it up as you go along life. To no kind of particular plan I don't have a strategy to this my strategy is surrender. It's that I realized I am not in control like I thought once I might have been and even Even then I kind of probably knew that yeah, I know my best laid plans. It's always going to turn out differently and there is stuff to do in life and To make stuff happen like for you to get the podcast going There's a lot of hard work but where it came from? I don't know I haven't asked you but where it came from might be some somewhere quite deep Somewhere beyond you almost like this

39:25 Well, I'm with you on that. And I can share about that. What I hear you saying is there's some kind of cultural societal pull on where we think we've got to go and get a job and somewhere else there's this divine destiny where if we only stopped and listened for a moment And I suppose you can wrap it up in the story of destiny and all that, you know what should happen. I didn't want to label it but... No, no but I'm not even sure if I believe in many of these things these stories. I love the idea with them destiny and whatever And I know we have choice In the end I don't think its that complicated I think it's utterly simple actually Here we are We feel stuff And you know

40:37 I know you know right? If you were still, if you were still, you'd know. It would fill your bones. You'd know that... There's something then about your bones that that resonate with that. It's like a harmonious chord, yeah, that you're doing the thing that goes with your bones. You know if you'd have been off buying companies for Hayes, uh, that...you realise after four days that wasn't harmonious with you and it might so I think whether destiny or whether you know like i said whatever your persuasion is there is something universally massive and equally tiny about

41:15 What are we supposed to do? What are we here for, what you have through your work clearly had an impact on you as an individual but equally it's had impact on communities, on institutions and I dare say even nations. And I know you've been commissioned to do work in South America of like Making sure stories didn't get lost to future generations. I say worse than that, I helped someone run for president of their country He got thrown off the ballot in the last week because they thought he might win and my job there was To ensure as best I could that the truth was told Yes if you hadn't have listened to that calling of pick up their camera

42:07 And this is really important because there will be people listening to this who are thinking, I should be... A gardener, or you know but then they'll be going well I couldn't possibly be a gardener because how can I make money out of being a gardener? You know it might transpire that they're supposed to discover how to save the rainforest or something but it would only have come through day one when they dug a rosebush and did the first day as a self-employed gardener. It's like...it's something about that hearing that calling hearing And Awareness, which is what we're talking about. You become aware of something awareness and as the world becomes more aware which it is. Awareness is a real pain in the ass. It's a terrifying thing you've become aware or something now you're left with just one or two choices do I continue on this normal? Or do I do something different so if you had

43:33 This overwhelming, deep-boned urge to become a gardener of some sort and it wouldn't go away. You'd become aware of it? Yeah It's going to be utterly painful if you don't do anything about it! Yeah but here is the thing this is what I live streamed on this morning is that many dads will suffer that thought for years maybe their whole life The You know, I won't say the head of a household. We're probably... A little beyond that but you feel responsible for kids and to be responsible you kind of want some sense of certainty so what you're doing is kinda you know where you are but it's already painful place to be in and another thing which is probably why

44:47 So, I'm going to start with a question that's been asked quite often. It is about the importance of knowing when you're in pain and how to deal with it. And what I find so energised by it And so the feeling of aloneness in that is, that's terrifying. That's destructive and I would imagine many dads are in that situation

45:30 You know, stuck in relationships that they shouldn't be in. But because of something that they've assumed and are stuck in jobs... Yeah, stuck in jobs. Stuck? Stuck in so many things! Stuck in a life they don't want longing for a dream or vision of a life they aspire to And stuck in a belief system Oh, that's a really interesting thing. So I years ago before i met you um... almost because I'd started taking these jobs so I just thought well what am I doing? I remember walking to Mintel market research company. I've been canoeing the Amazon and climbing mountains and crossing deserts. I ran away to become a flamenco guitarist! I literally left an agency, a marketing company

46:25 who that would kind of shares in the offing or some you know postpone ship yeah I took a one-way bus ticket to Granada having been playing the guitar for about a year. It wasn't very good, didn't really...I loved it! So i just went you know I did that and then I was in a market research company and walked in the doors but oh yes but I didn't know what to do I was completely lost in my entire environment so I was kinda wondering why And I'd done some things. There was a course that went on, which was one of the things... I kind of put together and worked out and someone told me how the human mind works. I thought this is brilliant! I know why i did those things. I know the nature of the relationship between the conscious and unconscious mind and how ideas get on It's simple

47:20 And it's rectifiable. So I said... Was that a breakthrough for you? That was like a doors of perception, like how old were you what was the course? Oh! I was in my 30s and it was a bit of information that was useful but I thought it was far more useful than actually was. I set up business to do this and I remember Sitting and so basically reprogramming your mind. It was before the movie The Secret, it was before NLP became Ready Player One... I had a similar experience after doing the Landmark Forum that I had a similar experience Oh right! So yeah oh I got a funny story about the head of Landmark telling me that I had to be the head of US landmark looked me in the eye and said you don't understand this You have to do it And I said I have no need for it

48:15 Yeah. And I just looked at her and she stormed off! Anyway, so this programming thing it was really useful because what I realised was wow you got shit thoughts you kind of have a shit life You have rosy thoughts, you have this kind of rosy life that's the explanation your thoughts become things in some respect that is kinda true and i thought well this is great I'm really good at it I can play my guitar and speak And I know how to speak from awareness. I can get people to fill their, flood their unconscious mind and then put it on their unconscious with these dreams, these wonderful dreams and about not that long into the business...I remember maybe 40-50 people laid on a carpet in Houston in a hotel in Houston

49:09 And I had this other voice, it didn't have any words but just like the film voice that would come and it just said you can never do this again. And what is said was if it had words and I came to understand them, you can never do this because there's no freedom or your doing is replacing The Jonnie Jensen Show, Jonnie Jensen, Nic Askew, Roger Black, YouTube

49:54 Oh no, you know if you sit still enough and I don't mean necessarily go through the steps of what people might call meditation. I don't think it's...I don't think there is anything to do surrender is surrendering but its not an act. I understand that most of what I do now It's the experience of that so how does sit with people sometimes with a camera sometimes not and there is just surrender And then something consumes one me all the time Not all the time thats wrong Where the dreams came from, and it's not necessarily the big dream of the point in your life because I'm not even sure about that. But sometimes its like to your coffee or nothing its that there is this kind of we are inextricably part of this life part of this universe. I know that. I've never felt disconnected by the way. I don't know why? I've never and I didn't realize people did feel that way. I have no idea why

50:57 It's almost like there is nothing that isn't in the ether. It's almost like information is just pulled down and we get in its way, and so where one's dreams come from, where one's why comes from, where ones purpose comes from, where one's instruction to move the next footstep comes from can come from 1 of 2 places it can come from almost what you believe to be true which has usually been Inherited from somewhere. You know, like you've looked out the world and it's told you what to think and you believed it to be true then believe that to be original thought I in fact wrote a terrible poem once very rude one about God And I can't remember the first line exactly but it said something like If no one had ever told you of God What would be your sense of God? Like if no one had told you a single word Very disturbing

52:11 And if no one had ever told you of you, what would your sense of yourself be? No one had uttered a single word to you about yourself. There was no reflection in an advert there was no mirror there were no parents telling this or that and so I realized that everything that i believe is...there's something really mysterious about it and liberating about as well and I guess as a result it becomes simpler for

52:49 One's life to be lived, a life to be lived through you as opposed to by you. And that's... I won't say it's easy. I'm not saying any of this is easy because we still live in a world that refracts and reflects all sorts of things and you don't know… But does it take some of the responsibility off us? We're always a bit numb to what life could be like if we were living like that Yeah, I mean the weight of the world. I was going to read something else...I just thought I put this on the front of the site at the moment and it- I was ready for with this project That's on your site? On The Point Of Us? Yeah! I've got a few sites but thepointofus.com is really where i've looked to try and do something about this sense

53:46 What not to do for the sense of peace and belonging, really. Yeah For this kind of surrender there's nothing to do I don't necessarily understand its nature but i know that uh...I can do stuff and it seems to happen But I was trying put in context and this is what I wrote I just said Many if not most of us live with an underlying sense that we're not enough as we are It drives much of what we do And how we are And so...

54:50 I'm just thinking of the amount of effort expended by us in our lives, trying to become someone. Someone worthy of getting through the gates of... I think I wrote in one piece, or getting through the gates of heaven on Nirvana or some cultural equivalent. Getting through the gates of success so that then we'll be enough and will be acceptable and will be okay Well, I think

55:59 A horrific percentage of people would never even have that thought. So they're just, they are completely closed off to it. You know this conversation in many parts is flipping blown my mind because you listening intently and you're talking about not listening so intently. And as I'm hearing your words, I'm thinking like wider and wider You know, I've taken a fair few drugs in my time. And those experiences expand your conscience you have different thoughts and it's...you can't go back after having or seeing that the doors of perception widen or whatever so when when you're hearing some of your message, your concepts, your observations it's startling at times because if I'm thinking

56:55 How could I think more like that? How could I take more time in those moments? What would my experience of others and of life be if I did that more often, you know. Has there been things that I've missed...I didn't see, I didn't hear. You know in looking to my left I miss the person on my right who was actually the person I'm supposed to see like it's profound And for everybody rushing around trying to get somewhere and trying to force something or create something, stop something from happening. It makes me want to stop and say to those people particularly people who are struggling

57:38 In truth, is there actually something that you need to be struggling about right now? Like the struggles is something we think we should be upset about. We think we should be upset about the relationship ending or we think we should be upset about losing our job... Is in reality, is there a struggle right here and if you took a moment to sit there peacefully what really is going on and what could you create out of this moment rather than fear it? Yeah yeah I I get it. It doesn't really make a lot of sense and you know what, what i'm talking about isn't really for the mind. I don't think and it's terribly... You know in a way it is quite offensive to the status quo you know? What I realized- Oh! Totally does. Right so what I realized this was this one was I always thought I was just stubborn

58:35 But what I realize is everything that i'm talking about and everything that I've done since the moment I picked the camera up, no one told me. I have never been a seeker. I was never looking. I haven't been a member of religion or spiritual tradition...I am not a seeker! I wasn't looking for an answer to anything What happened was just like the tree dreams. I'd just sit there when things occurred. I wasn't trying to get them to occur Yeah And I realized this way There's nothing

59:13 Here we are, it's okay. You're a part of this There is nothing required It is totally and utterly unconditional You belong here, it was unconditional you have almost access to things that you wouldn't dream off but there is no condition, you don't have to learn it There is no action We always assume that for something to change in other words the way we feel and circumstances as well To change something needs to be done And so starts this human journey of, you know looking over there. You know I wonder if they've got a huge personal development industry based on and I think some of it's probably wonderful. I don't haven't really taken part in it but that's an awful lot of advice about what you have to do to get to this thing called... Yeah but to be clear a lot of what you're speaking off

1:00:06 Is stuff that you've, I've learned from landmark courses or from other personal development stuff. So these individuals these companies they don't own that people can discover this on their own journey and that's why it was a bit strange that woman would say that to you in truth i think she is probably so excited too like oh my gosh if he knows all this already imagine him knowing even more No she didn't know me Oh, she didn't know you at all. Well that's very landmark is that they're so excited to have everybody taste the... Yeah but I mean the point in saying that this just exists it doesn't need to be conjured up your you being enough you being okay you being a peace doesn't need any conjuring it doesn't need a change of circumstance

1:01:04 It needs the opposite. It needs nothing and then you see so it's just about the recognition of what it is that you are And I'm talking about this kind of very ethereal connection, often people were talking to me about well what do you talk about belonging? And I going oh yeah its not belonging to a group of people or golf club or something like that Its belonging to this all Because when you realize, when you catch sight of the fact that you are a part of this and not... You understand it. You know it There is no question That puts you in a much or very different place I remember someone came away from some stuff we do on the camera And he said nothing changed In other words, we hadn't done anything Yet everything seems different and then everything starts changing

1:02:05 And I think that, you know that comes from this kind of sense of surrender as opposed to pushing forward to a point over there. Yeah and if one was to look for the strength to follow through something that you're aware about about something that's just come to you whether it's being a gardener or spending more time with your kids or going over there Just be aware of where that's come from. Has it come from your fear of not having something, of not being enough and looking over there at my God, that guy over there Jonnie he's already got it made you know or maybe I should do a podcast etc which is generally the way of life? Or did it was it kind of handed to you? Did it consume me with no doubt still hard because you don't know what to do but at least

1:03:07 I have no idea. Like with the camera, why... The camera? That was stupid! I'd never done anything like that. I hadn't really taken a photograph before I don't like it didn't make any sense, but somehow I knew. It's like that's not gonna go away. That just haunts me. Well that Roger Black video right because you showed me it You know He was pretty much the first person you interviewed and you'd done some NLP or training old life coach training type stuff had you or something at that point? No no So you decide well Well, you were asking him questions. Actually in the ways of many podcast interviews today or what people are up to on their YouTube channels you sat down with Roger Black and asked him about his journey way before anybody... You said that YouTube wasn't even invented then so way before anybody was doing stuff like that

1:04:00 Yeah, you know I'd had a... He was runner by the way. A British Olympic 400 meters or something? Yeah he won yeah 400 meters very fast and our dads used to work together. He was needed target for me at the doctors And he was like my brother's best mate when they were five and I know his twin sister really well, Julia. And so I was around his house and you know to my best knowledge it was the first time I stuck a camera in front of someone... It really stuck in my mind! Really stuck in mind. A grey table on a balcony type thing or something? Yeah this is what I remember of it and I remember it quite well then that was called about certainty

1:04:43 And he was talking about what we're talking, actually thinking about it. He was talking about what we're talking about because when you know, you know, you don't know how you know, you just know and then your job is, you've become aware of something do you dare to something about it? I think that's what the film is about and my memory is I didn't really ask him anything this was like in the early days I didn't know what i was doing. I still don't, you know like if I'm...I go and film someone now I've got this huge catalogue and I've filmed you know lots of well-known people but mainly not well known people You know also I've been..You know I've helped someone run for president I've been banned from the top university in the world or they say they are because the Dean was worried about what I might ask them

1:05:35 You know, truth has a terrible... you know like if you're in front of the camera and... Ironic that most your videos are you not asking anything and he banned you for what you might ask. Yeah! An implicit misunderstanding of what this is but there is this coercive energy almost that just seems to force it out of you And, you know I've filmed multiple murderers. All sorts! It doesn't really matter. I see the same look In fact one of the odd questions that i used to get asked perennially well not perennially every day in the early days was where on earth do you find these people?

1:06:17 And that seemed a really odd question to me. It's like I got lucky and all the ready-open people lived in my podcast, you know, SW4 But what people were already saying, I came to understand was that I don't see people like that and the answer is there is no one that it's not if you were to give them your full and undivided attention If you were to, in the space between us remove everything. Remove your need for this to be anything. Remove your need to help them, to serve them, to fix them To make them look a certain way show their best side if that all goes someone just feels something and You could dress it up in all sorts of ways they feel safe enough I don't think there's even other none of that is cognitive It's just

1:07:10 It's eerie in a way, but then you start to understand it's mysterious. But life is mysterious. It's an utter mystery and that's one way of living. What kind of impact or what kind of value has this brought to you as a dad? In your family I mean... You know it was like having this mystical, wonderful deep conversation with me and then you're gonna go downstairs and tit about make a milkshake and play table tennis like yeah is there elements of this that you've brought into your family where you have been able to feel perhaps that your better connected or there's more open communication on like what difference do think this has made to you in your role as a father? Yeah I don't know. Sometimes it's great

1:08:06 And sometimes I think it's really difficult. Sometimes, I think I probably like most dads here get too much into their work you know you've spent too many hours wondering about the nature of this and that and still attempting to make the mysterious work which you can't do by the way...I come to understand that i just keep forgetting it um and so you know I think double-edged sword some And especially now they got older, like our eldest daughter. You know there are some really cool conversations and I can see her questioning everything in this rather mysterious way you know to take one of my lines into a religion class

1:08:54 and say well, what if no one had told you about God? What would be your sense of God. You know or something like that but to understand the nature of it is kind of cool I mean um...I think it gets a bit much from sometimes actually because I do question everything but not big..not to be bloody minded and just really intrigued how could you say that and not consider what he said I know how you can see that and not consider so You know, I think the household is... you know there's a lot of kindness and you know i'm hoping that they pick up on that. I think you can't help but not pick up on that. Yeah, of course! But I'm going to carry on. But in many ways it's probably a normal household We don't have a great deal of strife although we do have one of the kids who's quite difficult and she's just difficult

1:09:55 for whatever reason and you know I think we probably it's probably similar to many, many places. What what I think we're quite good at is realizing that if anyone's stressed there there's a reason for that you know and there's a projection often then suddenly get to realize that that's kind of great that's quite good but... Well that is important to say hang on a minute everyone What's going on here? Because we could ignore the fact that something is going on and just go headlong into conflict over the next three hours. Or, we could acknowledge something is wrong here which one of us isn't well today or which one of us is upset about something. Something's not quite right here

1:10:41 And I'm getting better at that. Both my kids have hit puberty, didn't realise because one is a boy and one's a girl and they're two years apart but that basically means they're doing it at the same time. Oh yeah boys we are way behind. Is that right? We are way behind in every respect Yeah Rosie is 2 year younger but just to realise...I've had to adjust and be like okay so now they gonna be grumpy at times or there going to really like outrageously boisterous and I just got say Just let him be for as much as we can. But then I'll also say, just so you know that's about the eighth thing I've let go and it is not going to be a ninth okay? I could tell you that right now! You know this mysterious side that iIve been talking about... It isn't..it is otherworldly but one can live

1:11:35 You can live with your feet on the ground with that as well. But families, oh my god they're like... So do you think there's an exercise you can do? I mean to talk about landmarking again There is an exercise in one of the courses called The Be With Exercise and literally you stand in front of someone not allowed say anything you just be with them And like, people start crying. People start laughing. The response is unexpected across a hundred people, you know. And I know of families that do that periodically between themselves so there's tension, there's arguments, there's stress and strife and then we're just going to reconnect and so the be with is you can sit there in peace like you do in your movies and just let what needs to be said come up as an emotion more than a verbal thing

1:12:35 Yeah, and so I'll sit with my wife. An interview – I call it an interview – with the camera rolling We did it in 40 minutes one word just one word And that was the experience that I was talking about Having done it with kids I always found it quite difficult to tie them down into a chair You know like there's always been so much... maybe they will come a time But it is To try and understand it, how to do it well. You know a family? Yeah yeah And you try your best It's like wow you know I wonder...I wonder and then realize that you'd- you know I remember once hearing someone say I don't even know who it was I think my wife told me and I thought that was a good idea Your job is to really not get in the way of your children You've got sure you gotta make them safe and I'm not even totally convinced about education

1:13:37 You know, and we have used Waldorf if you know the Steiner schools. Right yeah, on the Steiner, yeah. Yeah so very contrarian education but I'm not sure... We saw our job as not getting in the way as best we could and doing anything in service of a kid working out what on earth they're doing here. On this really profound level. I don't know whether we got that but I think there'll come a time soon where maybe there'll be more of that. I mean, I'm always digging it and I think Caroline's doing that as well We did Steiner with Rosie for about year and It didn't sit well with her. It didn't sit well And I've got friends who were at Steiner schools and absolutely love it so I totally see the value

1:14:28 Oh my god, who's the English guy that just died? The writer. He wrote a lot about education. They always do this. Scouser! Awesome guy. Oh yeah yeah I know and comedian well he seemed like a comedian. Can someone... Yes check us out we're almost there His book was The Impact or The Edge, Ken... Anyway that's it. We'll put in the show notes and work out but I got here is a question just before we finish did your wife marry the adventurer? Or the executive? Yeah the free spirit. So oddly it was as mysterious as everything else in life pretty much my life anyway

1:15:22 I collided with her in the Bahamas, and I didn't mean to. And I saw her... met her and I didn't-I don't think i said it out loud but I meant is like oh it's you! I knew her yeah I'd never met her and then one thing led to another she flew to London a few weeks later um and then we were just chatting and then I said I think I said something like well so when exactly are you going to marry me? You know, it just kind of came out. I didn't mean to say it and just kinda came out so we got married and there was this real sense of ancient something and that's like, oh this is stupid she's far too small And she's American for goodness sake what's that about? you know, I'm in London I've traveled the world but never really even felt like going into America Didn't see the place but yeah It's out of your control if you notice it then do something about it become aware So I think she probably

1:16:25 And Lean into it because there's probably a lot of magic and answers inside of that awkwardness. Yeah, like what if there was nothing? Nothing at all that you didn't know Like people love to say that we're connected everything is connected Well if it was there's nothing That you don't know but you are not connected too What did that were true would you do something with it would you yeah And and the route to recognizing that was nothing

1:17:23 In other words, if there was nothing to do because everything you do got in the way. Everything Nic and Jonnie does gets in the way of us just knowing that then you might spend some time being quite still sitting under the tree of dreams almost like waiting for something to recognize your soul and consume me with no doubt not even just for the big stuff just...you just know you know like the person And so, here's I think an awesome way to probably end this all off.

1:18:13 If someone wants to tap into this, if someone's not really into this or hasn't considered it before possibly even unlikely they're still listening but I'll clip out and put at the front. But there is definitely value in this kind of peace and connectivity giving time to consider what's really going on rather than rushing about looking for it In your work and in your experience, is there a way that someone can tap into it? Is it as simple as being still for periods of time? I'm using stillness not as the absence of movement by the way. Right. I'm not talking about sitting cross-legged on top of a mountain listening to vegetarian music. I'm not talking about that. Right right. I'm talking about a stillness, otherwise an absence of trying to look

1:19:16 I wrote this piece called An End to Seeking. You know, it's a contribution but i did see that every time i looked i was blind and therefore if i stopped looking and would just enjoy the experience of sitting with you If something found me and didn't come from me And so to understand even have an idea that you might have You might be part of something far more magnificent than you ever thought. That's not the right word, far larger than you thought with more capacity than you ever thought but you didn't need to do anything to deserve it and the way to it

1:20:13 The Jonnie Jensen Show, Jonnie Jensen, Nic Askew, Roger Black, YouTube Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. But there is this thing... So that! There's nothing required like a life force or something It's just there It's just you are it and therefore if you're on this race to become someone Or this journey to become someone because someone told you so or you assumed that that was what they were telling you Because everywhere you looked

1:21:10 From your early days in education, I'm at school. I've got to come better. I've got to pass this. I gotta do that or you're in a job That's the way I've got to get up there Or your parents saying you could be better at that You could do this...you'd be safe if you did that To a billboard saying you could look like this If only you did that All those things that people were told to or around you and you took on board What if You didn't have to play that game. Yet you could still play that game, you could still go through this journey of life and become all those things but you didn't need to because you just knew somehow you knew. Back to the first thing I said maybe about picking the camera up...I don't want it i didn't believe it. I wasn't convinced that I had to do this It just came from somewhere. I just knew there was no doubt There's not no doubt about lots of things. I'm totally uncertain with most things

1:22:09 I don't know what's gonna happen, but i know...I don't think I know. I know picking a camera up was a good move for me and I know there's something that will never die That's the thing I really know. I don't know how I know and it's not Nic will never die But there's something that I'm part of with that will never die And somehow you know There's a faith in that and it's not in a faith called anything because I don't know how I know it I just know it and I think that's probably Deep down in everyone, everyone has that capacity because they are at least part of them is part of that as well. It's all mysterious and it was like I got this poem called the Glorious Ignoramus and it basically describes... I'll read it as a last thing you know? I've go to do this just cause... It's tough listening to someone what you're saying because

1:23:13 As I'm listening to your words, it's making me think so hard like so profoundly and deeply that when you stop talking my brain is just left there going what's happening next? Where do i take that thought basically. Yeah but what if he didn't have to take it anywhere No no really I really hear that Like when you read something profound that you've not considered before or, or you suddenly have reason to question how you thought things occurred or things existed before and your like oh wow what if I don't have to worry about all those things? What if I didn't have to fear that was going to happen. What if my marriage ended because I was supposed to experience that and learn that lesson so that I could take it forward and help others

1:24:12 So, you know suddenly so much of what we were running towards or running away from it becomes so pointless because it was just there for us. Good or bad right? Or wrong or cold... It was just there for us to go through. Yeah I had one guy a Canadian guy in front of the camera once and he said oh man that that was like deja vu and insight and

1:24:49 Thought that doing nothing would allow him to see that. Yeah, but I think that's as simple as it gets But you know like what if that were true? That would be wonderful news You wouldn't be lazy because you would be inspired, you know drug something from within would drive you And I think that's maybe what people want. They wanna feel like their life is lived through them, you know? And it's bigger than the character called Nic who's trying to just get by... It takes a lot of pressure out of situations and families and primate... Yeah so this last piece then I guess we should go but it was called The Glory Signoramus

1:25:32 I wrote it kind of as a joke to describe someone who was trying to work me out. And, yeah, I realized it kind of described how I am when... when I'm sitting with my camera and someone in front and so I said these words and they're called the glorious ignoramus It says or it goes I don't know but I know that I don't know I love that I don't know That I can never know for sure So I've stopped looking to understand you or convince you and now finally, I can see you. I'm a glorious ignoramus. Yeah

1:26:11 I loved, in fact i might write a part two because it's really...I think we probably all are a glorious ignoramus. Ignoramus meaning you know the latin for we don't know. So like, I don't know not for sure. We don't know what we don't know? No no exactly but also even when you think you do know it you probably don't and so but the wonderful thought is whether we understand it or not isn't going to make it work any differently The life and the universe or whatever you call it still goes on. So, it's almost like nature doesn't need us to understand it to work so we're off the hook on that. We don't need any sense of control. Almost like you should strike this entire conversation and go well if there was anything that sounded like it might have been true just discount that because it might not be. You do get to consider it. It's like this has might have just been two guys... Well actually one guy is talking bullshit

1:27:06 Now we really are going back to some acid days. I've hardly ever touched a drug, and I remember one person describing an acid trip to me. I'm going, damn mate! I walk around like that? You do?! And someone in front of the camera once goes oh my god they said the veil just dropped. What do you mean? He said she's had taken ayahuasca 97 times That's what happened, but we didn't do anything. Yeah and I was about to say that because i've read on the subject and you know in kind of crude terms we're messing with the brain, we're messing with chemicals in the brain but actually it is the brain so that state that we've caused we could create on its own basically

1:28:06 To a large degree, that's what you've spoken so wonderfully and profoundly about. And it is nothing but it is also a thing and it's accessible And this conversation might have been quite tricky for some people to stay connected to, just to follow. But if they can go back and listen to it, they've got some extra hours in their life maybe put it on a one-and-a-half speed or something but they can actually go back and listen a couple of times because the wisdom is in there. They just gotta actually take a moment to hear it, to really hear it. Yeah, yeah, it might be utterly confusing to people hopefully so

1:28:52 Hopefully so. Myself as well, if I listen back to it go what was they saying? Wow! I wonder if its true. Tell us about the point of us because if anything... oh by the way Ken Robinson was the guy we were talking about before he wrote The Element. Sir Ken Robinson yeah. Sorry it's called Sir Ken Robinson. The point of us is your latest So The

1:29:57 Essentially what was happening was the nature of what I've been talking about, it's a surrender. Often it would be provoked by just sitting very still in front of the camera and watching people with these big images suddenly just give up needing to be anything or needing to beat anything they weren't just being you know they were just there and that would...it would provoke this feeling This real sense of we really are part of this. The thing that people, so many people write about but it wasn't... We never even really spoke about it much It was just there and it was felt and it profoundly affected

1:30:36 Many people and the relationship between them. And I was always just craving, really yearning that people should know each other like I know so many thousands of people That have been exposed to parts of the work anyway And I just thought, wouldn't it be cool if people knew each other? And then because they knew each other through this work then they didn't have the bullshit of just saying well i'm Nic and i'm a filmmaker and i'm from London. They didn't even need to do that! Like participation was not based on anything you did The mere fact that you had a pulse was enough

1:31:16 And it was okay if you sat on the edge till the end of time and he never said a word, never even said your name. He was still part of it. I guess that's the reason for me creating this thing called The Point Of Us which then there is segment which is called The Us Community It's basically so people can come along and experience that and realize that no one had to tell them like there was nothing to learn There was nothing to do And so maybe, I don't know. Maybe some people might be able to just set down this effort of trying to become someone because they don't feel enough. Maybe there was a community of people that you could sit in and you just know that you're okay and that's really what it is. So when I was drawn, what I realized was yeah, I do make films. I suppose I'm a filmmaker in some respect but really what it was about was surrender

1:32:19 So This has just been wonderful, Nic. I'm so... You're really good at this by the way! I know because i've been interviewed by lots of people Okay thank you Yeah no you are, uh..I mean that Umm..although you said you were trying to get it up here, you didn't show signs of that Not really Like getting caught in what would be a clever question What would be? You know which so many interviews are Would you know what

1:33:20 Over the years of doing this or doing videos and you know, the more preparation and it's not like I don't prepare but you can create a load of questions. And sure sometimes that makes for a nice consistent format across podcasts and stuff but actually to have real conversation and allow it to flow... For me? I enjoy it more! I still have to control people sometimes like And Most people, more often than not will say exactly what you just said to me. And so I take great encouragement and satisfaction in that because if people enjoy being interviewed, if they enjoy being part of the conversation then there's a chance that people will enjoy listening to it.

1:34:29 What a brilliant, brilliant 60 minutes with an awesome guy. I mean Nic has done stuff right from Amazon Adventurer to accidental managing director to picking up a camera and becoming this And I hope you enjoyed it. If you know other dads who you think, if you've heard people on other podcasts... if there's a famous sportsman DJ stunt man

1:35:17 Space Man, who you'd like to hear on the Team Superdad podcast then connect us up and drop me a message. Let me know who it is and I'll see what I can do to get them on or maybe it's you! Maybe your dad? You don't have to be famous or successful even but if you've got a story, if you've got something The Jonnie Jensen Show, Jonnie Jensen, Nic Askew, Roger Black, YouTube

1:36:02 Subscribe to this podcast if you haven't already, that way you'll be sure to get all the latest episodes. I do the wrap-up on Friday there's episodes like this and working on getting a group together to do a live sports podcast except it is not about sport obviously and so it's all happening thanks for joining me today! I really appreciate your time your ears your heart see over in Team Superdad community and all of our programs Jonnie here, Team Superdad out bye This has been Team Superdad. Find us at teamsuperdad.com